New Mars Forums

Congratulations Adrian!!!

I'm on the volunteer list as Virtual Mission Support, and will most likely be part of the Science Back Room.

Gotta love it when a plan comes together!!!!

I'm hoping ESA's missions to Mars will light a little fire under the collective butts of Congress.  Beagle 2 on the surface may get a few politicos asking what NASA has ready to bring the limelight back to US shores. 

Taikonaut bootprints on Luna, and the planting of the Chinese flag next to the US one, would get some things rolling.  Imagine a conservative Congress watching the "godless commies" become a part of a very exclusive club.  "UN Security Council member, nuclear power, and now they've made it to the Moon!" 

Imagine the political brownie-points the People's Republic would get by broadcasting the video images of Shenzhuo leaving the ISS far behind.

That eventually there will be children, I have no doubt.
I would definately like the infrastructure increased before any families get created.

Small children do not each much, true.  Their little lungs do not use much oxygen, true.  But......

Infants are not capable of caring for their own needs, thus someone has to, thus decreasing the workforce available for other activities.

Unless our colonists are nudists, each one of the children will require clothing, that will have to be produced in different sizes.

The children will have to be schooled in some fashion to become contributing members of the colonies.  Even if the home-schooling method is chosen, and electronic textbooks used, they will need assistance and power will be required.

Expecting mothers will require some form of medical care to guard against complications.  Women have died in childbirth throughout history, and if it happens in the colony, then exactly who is to be removed from the workforce to care for the child?

I do see a massive building boom, if only the attempt of the colonists to escape from the smell of diapers.

turbo, veteran of more diaper changes than I care to remember

I could live with NASA doing a moonbase.  I would laugh heartily at the gates of Kennedy when a manned Mars mission lands and NASA was left out of the whole thing.

L1 and L2 stations to me is nothing more than a way to keep the Shuttle program going. 

If I ask really nice, would ESA let me put of those great decals on Beagle?  The really good ones that have "HEY EARTHLING!" and an alien giving the "middle finger salute".
What a perfect shot to get from the ISS cameras!

If an underground network of trains, rocketsleds or electric tricycles connects the colonies, then could not a single team of specialists perform the "mechanic" needs ?

To attempt to stay on topic, I can just see the following scenario:

Male Settler:  "Dear we can have up to four kids if we start now! Our family could be the biggest on a new planet, think of the fame!"

Female Settler:  "I did not get a Master's degree, run myself ragged at Star City, and spend eighteen months in a closet with one shower per week, to be barefoot and pregnant."

Male Settler:  "But we NEED children to be the new technicians!"

Female Settler:  "We NEED more robots to prospect for water, go impregnate a rover!"

Somehow, I don't see the first females to Mars considering themselves to be breeding stock.  Serious brains and abilities will be needed for the colonies to work, and competition to fill billets will be fierce.  There may be several decades between first landings and first native Marsians, probably longer.  The colonies should have time to be ready for children.

turbo

I figured Jeb was going to get it.  That's fine by me, the Republican sweep was a little surprising.

I did find out that:  A) Smoking is no longer allowed outside one's vehicle or home.  I wonder what the politcs plan to do as the sports bars die off as the smokers stay home to watch games.  I'd like to have some land just over the Georgia line right now.   

and B) pregnant pigs in Florida may no longer be caged, tethered, or otherwise restrained.  I have heard this little gem is now a Amendment to the Florida Constitution!

I guess now emigrating to New Mexico is out, unless Cindy knows how a former resident of Alamogordo can claim temporary insanity and move back.

Uh, Shaun, would the Land Down Under let me claim political refugee status?

turbo

I'm not so sure Mars is dying.  Earth has undergone ice ages, and Mars being further from the Sun maybe needs more time to complete the cycle.

Since this thread is most active, I want to ask something:

Does anyone on these forums no anything about experiments supposedly done at the Space Biology Laboratory of Moscow University in 1980?  It seems terrestrial lifeforms were subjected to Mars-like environemt.  The birds and mammals expired in seconds, turtles and frogs lasted hours, insects for weeks, "but fungi, lichens, algae, and mosses quickly adapted temselves to the new environment: oats, rye, and beans sprouted and grew but could not reproduce."  The quote comes from "Genesis Revisited" so I am rather skeptical.

I am still trying to locate that old book with the British scheme for "bombarding" Mars with algae (or lichen) from Antarctica.  So far no luck.

I can't classify myself as either Green or Red, but I'd like to keep the "techno-imperialist" if that's okay.

turbo

Hello All!
So far my inquiring mind has found out that radishes, carrots, and especially broccoli do well in cold conditions.  Lettuce can handle some cold, but broccoli is the champ since it can endure freezes (millions of eight year-olds shudder). 

One of the only things the Environmental Science class taught me was that the higher the lifeform, the more food it takes to sustain.  I love animals, really, but there is no way I'd spend eighteen months in a soup can with chickens.  Japanese or not, the hens would be either quickly consumed or just plain flushed out the airlock.  I figure I could take the noise and the mess for about three weeks, then the ammonia producers would be standing on my last nerve.

So, now that I know greenhouses on Mars could let me make a chef's salad, I have to ask your esteemed personages about a concoction I have occasionally seen, but as yet unwilling to try.  The stuff is called "soy milk", and if it turns coffee into concrete, I think I'll stay in Mission Control.  I'm wondering though, since the methane generators that go "moo" would be very difficult to transport, could a Yank like me actually get along with soy milk?

Any room in the greenhouses for peanuts?  Not only do they happily return nitrogen to the soil, but they can be roasted, boiled, or turned into peanut butter.  Let's have potatoes as well, now those are flexible! 

A note of caution:  I don't care if the package does say "Meal, Ready to Eat", the "meatloaf" and the "peanut butter" are supposed to be used to build fortifications.

turbo

The way the NASA budget comes and goes, I doubt anything other than ISS will be completed.  Some rework and some small boosters, and Mir could be orbiting Mars right now.  I remember when the decision came down to let Skylab die.

Maybe it's just me, but wasn't a golden opportunity missed by not retrieving that Saturn V third stage?  Up for decades with no Van Allen belt for protection, I bet that "spacejunk" could speak volumes about micrometeroids and long term radiation exposure of metals.  A "lessons learned" primer on how to build interplanetary craft.

Who was it before that mentioned salvaging the inactive nuke satellites and all?  Skylab was a converted third stage, now there's one already up there we can track.  Launch costs courtesy of Apollo.

The offer still stands on piloting Columbia to Cydonia!

If the Dutch East India Company worked the way NASA does, they'd never have gotten past the Azores.

Dear NASA, cojones are required for space.  Dear Congress, 100% success is not possible (this is a government project after all) so let the scientists and engineers experiment.
It's called "intestinal fortitude", and with it we have set foot on the Moon.  If none is left, then I expect a whopping tax return, I know a spaceport in need of repairs.

I have trouble growing mold, can I change the lightbulbs and still go?
"Green Acres is the place to be..."
I know, sit in the rover like a good boy and don't touch anything.   

Manned military bases on the moon may be great for intelligence gathering, but a satellite would be cheaper, harder to locate and destroy, and not need a logistics chain to keep going.

The LEO microwave weapons would only cause the US to go into full-scale production of one of the early Star Wars systems.  In short, an anti-satellite missile taken to high altitude by an F-15 and then launched.  Onboard systems or ground control would guide the missile to target.  A fragmentation warhead would do the job.

Japan's reliance on high technology would spark some kind of response to the orbital threat.  Ground-based lasers would stay within the "self-defense" provisions of their constitution.

Taikonaut all they want, join the orbital club, go to the moon, whatever.  I have no doubt everything will be closely monitored.

t

NASA = Not Aspiring to Space Accountants
Does this mean the 2001 Lander is going to get launched?  Hey, maybe the old Viking mock up sitting around Kennedy will get to circle the Moon.

Tell ya what, Columbia is getting too old, fill the cargo bay with bottled water and munchies and I'll set that puppy down right in the middle of Cydonia.

My Ford van will leave LEO before NASA does!