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Direct drive is what? I haven't seen that option in many showrooms.
Probably because you haven't seen electric and/or hybrid electric without coupled driveshafts in many showrooms. Basically, you put a wheel on one end of a variable speed electric motor and a power source with a rheostat on the other end.
I would include direct drive with "automatic" in this case. Without that, I would have to change my vote: standard transmissions tend to be lighter, are simpler to build, have larger working tolerances, and are easier to repair than an equivalent automatic transmission. If you plan to ship one to Mars, fix it when it gets there, or make one from scratch, then choose a standard.
Neither standard nor automatic automobile transmissions can beat direct drive in any of those categories, though. Direct drive, golf cart style, is what we should use.
Oh, man, you're getting current images before the official website releases them.
I am so jealous! :twisted:
Opportunity is edging closer to Victoria Crater. We should be peering in over Duck Bay within the next couple of weeks.
There are already a few features of interest in the panoramic camera images.
Must be something wrong with my eyes - the text in this thread looks all strange...
May I interrupt the flame testing and ask if there is, in fact, an objective answer to the original question?
Standards organizations like ISO, ANSI, ASME, and AIAA publish guidelines and certified standards for aircraft, submersibles and pressure vessels for human occupancy here in the States. Title 14 of the US Code of Federal Regulations has been expanded to include safety certification of spacecraft, including manned vehicles.
Is it possible that there is a list of applicable published standards that, if adopted, could define what's necessary for a man-rated rocket?
I have to repeat:
Theoretically, it could work with a wide range of engine types.
This scheme would not be limited to ion rocket propulsion.
As for the whole waverider thing, yes, I agree that hypersonic aerodynamics are an important consideration even in rarefied gases, and nothing released by JP Aerospace or their competitors indicates that they plan to use a variable wing configuration to keep the wings pulled inside the Mach angle all the way up. But keeping everything behind the leading shock is merely the optimum condition for hypersonic flight, not the only possible condition.
Also, I actually got curious enough to try to model this thing once, and I have to ask: What makes you think they aren't trying for a waverider?
PS - *GASP!* You just tried to kick my pet!
When it comes to "pet" launch technologies, my personal favorite is the Airship-To-Orbit scheme proposed by JP Aerospace.
I even scratched out a New Mars wiki article about it.
Theoretically, it could work with a wide range of engine types.
It's probably just the old delta drive scam all over again, but...
I wonder where the measured force is coming from in his apparatus?
We're assuming it's Shawyer's thumb on the end of the balance, but it doesn't have to be. This could be a case of inadequate experimental design or the deliberate obfuscation of proprietary information.
Microwave cavity Lorentz forces are a real enough phenomenon, and it is theoretically possible to use them to transfer angular momentum. If he is really measuring something and not just having us on for fun and profit, it might not be a thrust, but a twist.
A solid state "flywheel" would still be worth having, and quite useful on a spacecraft. There could still be something to this, even if the fluff piece cited isn't realistic.
Other groups likely to publish to higher standards than New Scientist are getting involved. If it's a sham, we'll probably hear from them shortly. I say we wait for the big reveal.
If our best hope for long term survival of the human species is expansion into the solar system, that sounds like a good argument for bringing manifest destiny back in vogue. Maintaining the "illusion" of multiculturalism makes it easier to decide who to invite along.
I care because people refuse to reason because of Christianity; i should not of had to explain that;
I wish that wasn't true. Being christian is no excuse to leave your brain in the church coat room. But unfortunately, this insidious idea is coming back into favor with many religious sects of all flavors. The only defense I can offer is that atheists aren't the only people who have to deal with it.
Beyond that, a man walking on water and performing all manner of miracles would of had statues and pictures made everywhere;
I agree. If you would like to see some, I direct you to the churches and museums of modern day Rome where 2000 year old examples are on display and they are still making new statues and pictures of the fellow in question.
...a god would not have to go some crazy lengths to prove he's a son of god; he could just make everybody believe and we wouldn't have to go through hell on earth.
Being a dyed-in-the-wool deist, I won't go into discussion of what a god should or should not do, and you've already indicated your preference on being forced to believe. But I have to disagree with the assertion that we're all going through hell on Earth because of Jesus. We're going through earth on earth.
We've been warned of hell, and told of heaven, but we haven't been ordered to go to either one and won't get there for some time even if we go. IMHO, heaven and hell should not be anyone's deities. If hell even looks at you funny, turn your back on it. If heaven blocks your path to God, burn it. We suffer here, but Earth isn't all that much worse than heaven - God is with us in both places. If service to God is worthwhile, then it will have value right here on Earth. Heaven isn't a cosmic paycheck for services rendered, and is only worthy of respect because it is a gift offered by God. If He were not with us there, too, heaven wouldn't be worth the trouble.
Personally, I don't think Socrates ever existed either. He never published anything more than Jesus did, and like Jesus, the only record of him is in books and plays written by his buddies.
I suspect Plato and Aristophanes got together over a beer one day and made him up.
Interestingly, we do have independent confirmation that Pontias Pilate existed, and was in Jerusalem at the time. Surviving Roman records from the time describe him favorably as "cruel but just".
No mention of JC and the boys, though...
Why do the religious refuse to consider dynamic evolution for their static spirituality? That is why we try to show the anti rational religions wrong.
Actually, that's a good point. Take Christiantity, for example. Centuries of Christian theologians have insisted that spirituality is not static. Virtually the entirety of christianity claims their religion came about as a consequence of a new covenant, in which God essentially renegotiated his contract. As a religion, it has been evolving since its formal inception, and there is a great deal of theology and philosophy acknowledging and exploring this fact. It's not difficult to argue that the religion that spawned the first christians was evolving even before that.
And there are also the offshoots of Christianity that refuse to acknowledge this. They do not know the history of their religion; neither do they care. They have as much contempt for history as they do for creation. They make an easy target for folks like your "Infidel Guy" - but that's all right. They need someone to take potshots at them once in a while, IMHO. Such evolutionary pressures keep the meme pool strong.
"Jesus almost certainly did exist as a historical figure."
That is an amazing statement of non-scientific thinking. Anybody know what's wrong here?
Yes. Clearly, because Jesus did not publish anything, he perished.
Let those who have ears to hear listen.
Here's video of a smaller strike on the Moon, released yesterday.
Are you sure we don't need Harry Stamper and his roughnecks?
Well, I'm mildly embarrassed. :oops:
It turns out that our new wiki didn't yet have sufficient information to answer Al's question #1. I've half-way fixed that by adding articles on escape velocity and kinetic energy, using Al's question as an example. However, it's still woefully deficient on any topic of gas dynamics, much less detached shocks and RTT.
That's a shame, because the questions asked pertain directly to the theoretical background of the Archimedes space probe being developed by the Germany Mars Society. It's bad when you can't even describe what your affiliates are doing...
How did General Orbital's proposal for that old airship hangar in California ultimately turn out?
New Mars is not a design forum, and even those of us who understand the physical concepts involved only have an answer to whether or not the thing is physically possible. That leaves us somewhere far below where JP Aerospace was four years ago.
So, it seems to be a safe enough offer for you.
Stranger projects have been proposed here, though, and a decade of Mars Society conventions clearly shows that there is no shortage of people willing to try. With the recent addition of a wiki that could allow for the public posting of original research, we could even put it together and make it look like a group. So, it’s not beyond the realm of possibility that someone would try to produce a design.
However, that would bring us back to questions about prior art and trade secrets. I stated earlier that I was content to leave that to your good offices under the circumstances, but we don’t have any. The most efficient way for a group from New Mars to pursue a project like that would be very public, making as complete a summary as possible of previous work freely available to each new participant.
I’d love it, but I don’t know if JP Aerospace and General Orbital Corporation would appreciate it as fully. I suspect it would run counter to their interests.
Do you have a suggestion for resolving that conflict?
(I also hope we start seeing fog from the water source I suspect is there, too, but we can't have everything... can we?)
Why should a water source be associated with these "wheel-embedding hazards"?
I've discussed the idea earlier in this thread, on pages 6 through 10. I've also got some comments in this thread on a similar deposit discovered by the Spirit rover. (Takes a while to dig them out, though.)
My reasoning regarding the Purgatory dune deposit being an indication of water comes down to three speculations:
1. The process that created the purgatory dune deposit probably involved freeze drying. (This explains why Opportunity displaced so little dust digging itself in; and why simply using a fine - but loose - powder as a soil simulant was only adequate for modelling the rover's ability to dig itself out, not its tendency to dig itself in.)
2. Dust deposition patterns indicate that the high albedo duricrust patches observed around Purgatory Dune are very recent - possibly younger than a year, certainly less than a decade. Examinion of other soil targets using the microscopic imager indicates that they would likely have filled in otherwise.
3. The pattern of cracking in those high albedo duricrust patches indicates outgassing.
It's all speculation at this point. But I'll keep watching.
I will admit that I'm a little more focused on getting to LEO than I am getting to Mars. You all are welcome to look that far ahead...
That's half the fun of New Mars, Al. 8)
I agree that use of big airships could offer lots of options, especially if we could get something to Mars that was capable of descent and ascent just like the vehicle your team is working on. I don't see how extra volume during the transit is an advantage - useful living space in a space craft is more a function of vehicle dry mass than of vehicle size. And I think the advantages might warrant their development, too. An orbital airship should have an easier time getting in and out of the Martian atmosphere than Earth's (steeper density curve, lower orbital velocity, same angular velocity, etc.), so that even if a smaller vehicle arrives than ascended from Earth, the slight boost in efficiency should still keep it functional at Mars.
Simply being able to deliver a working airship would be a tremendous help to a manned Mars expedition. Mobility is a major issue for such plans, and any aircraft with large crew quarters or even reasonable cargo capacity would be a gift from the heavens. Having one capable of serving as an Earth Return Vehicle would be a bonus on top of a bonus.
The minimum payload masses necessary to mount such an expedition are on the order of 10 to 20 tons, though, with 10 T being only possible if multiple separate modules are sent simultaneously to take up the slack. An orbital airship would need to be capable of getting at least that much to Earth orbit in order to support the entire mission infrastructure of a manned expedition to Mars.
Yes. I have not given up on the approach and have a new team that likes it. I think my designs have diverged over time, so I don't know that I would call them competing.
That's logical. After all, a Scout IV can't compete with the Space Shuttle any more than the other way around, despite the fact that they both employ similar technology. So, "alternative" would be a better choice of words. It does seem that prior art must still be an important consideration for you, though. The technology is so new, it's difficult to say where the USPTO would draw the line.
You've got a much better understanding of that situation than a randomly selected blogger like myself, so I'll leave that to your good offices, and proceed to the next important question:
Do you think this thing could carry a manned Mars mission? There and back?
Opportunity is stuck in another patch of powder. It's not dug in as deeply this time, and they anticipate having it out in a few days. However, this patch was encountered in a trough between dunes, not piled up like before.
I was expecting this would happen, and it will give us a second look at this type of feature. The wheel trenches are displaying the same sharp edges and minimal debris ejection as we saw the last time Oppy got stuck.
I hope the rover team spends more time on soil targets this time. (I also hope we start seeing fog from the water source I suspect is there, too, but we can't have everything... can we?)
I am now the CTO at General Orbital. I've carried my interests in inflatables over to our new company where we are putting our own stamp on things.
Hello Al.
Thank you for your responses on this topic, and congratulations. Inflatables have great promise for manned space exploration. I hope General Orbital takes off.
After your comments here and a clarifying comment you posted earlier in the New Mars wiki, I would like to ask you something else: Does General Orbital plan to pursue any competing designs for airship-derived spacecraft?
This isecco.org is good stuff!
JW, would you consider writing an article about their efforts for the New Mars Wiki?