New Mars Forums

Since kdb512 covered one item, I will deal with some others.

NATO basically took Kosovo from Serbia, breaking the "Never change borders" notion.  And it was for very similar reasons.  Just as the Russians claim that the west Ukrainians were persecuting the Eastern people, it was claimed that the Serbians were persecuting the Kosovars, if that is what they are called.

As for Alaska, that is sort of an outside item.

I was aware that the British had favored the USA in arbitration.  I certainly cannot know the motives of the arbitrators, as they may likely be dead and from another era, and continent.

I speculate that they were looking at two future possibilities.
1) Canada is attacked by the USA.  In that case they might be in a bad spot, so I am guessing they wanted to avoid that.  Keeping the Canadian claim would not have helped to protect Canada.
2) They feared a future conflict with a Eurasian entity.  Strategically, keeping only a "Peek-A-Boo" coast on the pacific would make it likely that the Americans would become involved on the side of Canada/British.  In north BC, the mountains, would be protective of a Canada/British position, and a Eurasian enemy would almost have to wade through the Americans to get there.  The case where America would be allied with a Eurasian invader is very unlikely, I think.  A case where America stood neutral while a Eurasian invader breached the continent, is also unlikely, but if it did happen, as I have said, the forces of Canada/British would only have to protect a relatively small but useful position on the Pacific coastline.

Should I feel bad as an America that the British favored us?  I don't think I will.  The idea anyway was to keep western Canada subordinated to the hard position of East Canada.  The British got what they wanted, and it may even have been the desire of the high powers in East Canada.  That I cannot know.

The whole issue of Ukraine stinks because Ukraine is at a crossroad between worlds.

The Green Throne is West Europe.  The Orange Throne has Russia at its core.  The Purple Throne has Turkey sort of at its core.  These are all large power that ebb and flow at each other.  If the conflict in Ukraine were simply a family feud, we could let them settle it themselves.  But these power centers all have an interest.  A massive "Glorius" war will not end in anything except piles of rotting flesh, and terrible lives and ending of lives.  And it is even harder for America to see why it should want to be involved in such a thing.  This is not the time of the turning of the wheel of time for that.  The sensible thing to do is to try to put out the fire, and indeed, good fences that each power may be satisfied with.

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Robert,

Lincons primary job was to keep the republic safe, against potential or real enemies.

Slavery at that time was becoming viewed by many as a bad thing but it was mostly accepted around the world.  Black Africans made huge money selling other Africans into slavery.  If you were male and were sold into Muslim countries, you would most likely be castrated.

If Lincon protected slavery, it was a glass half full, as significant parts of the republic had prohibitions on slavery.  The primary task was to keep the republic safe.

And despite propaganda, it was a fight between the federal government and rebellious regions of the country.  In fact, they did not have a right to seize federal property such as military bases.

It was not a war of the north against the south.  Some northern people went to the south, called wood ticks, I believe, and the reverse also occurred.

Many people of the North disliked slavery, because it was an unfair labor competition.  It would allow rich plantation owners, to get all the good land, leaving nothing for family farmers.  Both in Europe and the USA there were people who disliked slavery for various reasons.

In the south, if there was back-breaking labor to do, the plantation owners would hire "White Trash" to do it as they did not want to damage their property, slaves.  The poor white person damaging their back or something else was welcome to go away and die in pain.

In part because the British and French were teetering in the valley of decision, the federal government decided to seize the plantation owner's slaves as property, war booty.  I believe it was a legal maneuver.  Once the federal government had claimed ownership, it could free them at an appropriate time.  But that did not indicate that they intended to make them citizens.  I guess they became citizens later because it was impractical to do anything else with them.

Brazil for instance kept their slaves longer, and parts of Africa are rumored to still have some slavery.  And of course, we even catch people abusing other people like that in our country today.  Psychos, and sometimes people imported from other parts of the world do that.

For those thinking they are to have reparations, I would suggest they go to sub-Saharan Africa, first and demand them.  Then if they still live they can go to the Arabs and demand repatriations.

They don't disserve them anyway.  Freedom was a gift granted by our government, after it seized their ancestors as property.  War booty.

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As it happens the Russians could be useful to us at this point, and maybe they will be or not.  We will find out.  We can certainly be useful to them if they want to play it that way.

Life is down and dirty sometimes, it cannot be helped.

What the Russians are objecting to is reasonable, in Ukraine.  During the Cuban missile crisis, they put missiles into Cuba, because we had missiles in Turkey threatening them.  Our people generally don't know it, but the missiles in Cuba were removed on the condition that we remove the ones in Turkey.

The Russians were promised that Nato would not expand into Eastern Europe but expand it did.
Crimea was an essential naval base for them.  It had aways belonged to Russia but was awarded to Ukraine before the breakup of Soviet Union.  Russia was willing to rent bases from Ukraine but then the west did a coup to place a government in hostile to Russia.

As far as the other regions they have occupied, they were dominantly Russian in culture and the Ukrainians were oppressing them very badly, so Russia did what it has done.

Europe is not Europe.  It is just part of Europe.  Just because there is a Europe, the EU does not get to claim all parts of it as a possession.  As for NATO, it is not intended at all for expanding the EU into the rest of Europe.  Article 5 as I understand it is protective in nature, where a foreign power might attack a member.  There is no license to kick a bear in the ass and lead it to war to the USA.  We rightfully refuse that obligation.

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Knowing history and how Italy, Germany, and even for a time Russia could seek to reorder Europe and the world, I am very tempted to suppose that some actors in Europe and China, might like to see the USA and Russian wreck each other.  A very dangerous gamble on their part, but some dummies might think they could make it work.  Then possibly China is in Siberia, and North America is wrecked.  Such a China might roll over North America under those conditions.

Better thinking is needed.  Not simple minded thinking.

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Of course, in the UK, you are not very interested in cooling.  And you have plenty of water.

The bottom of a cold pond or lake will be at 39 degrees F.  (3.88888889 C).  So, the bottom water will insulate the slush above it, as that is the heaviest water.  Convection will not occur.

Shade Balls would insulate the top of the reservoir.

So, then you have phase change stored cold.  Many places in the world might value that.

And in addition, the shade balls could breathe.  For instance, if you did this in a place like Namibia, you might condense water into the slush under the shade balls.

https://namibiatoday.com/namibias-fog-n … -thin-air/
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I selected industrial heat, because that could be a money maker.  Then to use the slush to store cold and possibly to condense water from the air.  Wet topical places could use this as well.

For instance, Sub-Tropical, Florida.

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https://www.bing.com/images/search?view … ajaxserp=0  Quote:

Water is of value of course.  And getting water, heat, and cold, is also valuable.

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You should have allowed me to do more.

Actually, Iceland has been a republic for 1000 years, except for a 50 year occupation by Norway.

Democracy is bad.  We say democracy as it is easier to say than representative republic.  Of course you are not a representative republic.

I believe that a Scottish person said that "Democracy is where you can vote yourself a paycheck".  More or less.  It lends itself to a patronage system, which is what the Democrats were trying to set up.

Is Russia a "Real Boy" at this time?  Not so much, but they are also under deep stress.  We made it more possible for strong man dominance in Russia.  But we should be blessing Putin.  He is keeping the real daemons from getting power.  Him, we can deal with.  Of course they have expectations of our stupidity, as it has been very evident.

I could pick apart the logical story about what has happened, but you are not in the mode of logic just now, maybe we should just discontinue this dialog.

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https://www.rbth.com/politics_and_socie … war_823252

I believe that this age resembles that age.

At that time the British were strong in Canada, and Napoleon the III was in Mexico.  Obviously, the European powers were thinking about taking down the American Republic and they were also looking nasty at the Russians.  The deal was that Russia did not want its fleet bottled up in its ports, and the USA needed the Russian navy to discourage a full on assault from Europe.

The European Union is not that dangerous at this time, but we know how quickly the NAZI threat appeared from ashes of history.  It is not wise for us to trust that it could not happen again, the Western Europeans have been backsliding on so called "Democracy".

It does not look trustworthy.

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Worlds in collision.  Collateral damage.  It is not personal, and it is not within the powers of people like us to control.  But maybe more work is needed to handle exceptions.  America has to examine its other side, and that leads to friction with the British and French, who are asymmetrical in profile, which conflicts with our full spectrum nature.  I may or may not want to elaborate.  But in this era, Russia becomes a natural not quite partner, at a distance.

Canada is of course more or less still ruled by the British and French, so there is an incompatibility that has built up.  The main thing is to avoid a slaughterhouse, which our guy is trying to do.

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Thanks for the comment (th): https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 92#p230492

I am often looking for a "twofer" or better, and I might have one.

I used to live near very large mine pits: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=Ir … C3&first=1
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rouchleau_Mine
Image Quote: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ … -09-01.jpg

If you had a pipeline to flow the slush down to the bottom of such an artificial lake, you might store a glacier inside of it.

The put Shade Balls over the surface, to keep heat away: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tmfu5anMSA

So, then it you had a heating need, you could store the slush in a quarry or impoundment, for a future cooling purpose.

Norwegian Heat Pumps can reach 180 degrees C, which is considered good enough for some industrial heat needs.  Granted it might be hard to pull that heat from 0 degrees C ice formation but who knows, maybe it can be achieved.

So, if that heat need is satisfied you might then make a glacier that you could draw on for cooling, perhaps in the summer.  Not so much needed in the UK, but in continental climates such as the interior of the USA, or desert climates it might be acceptable.

And the glacier with plastic balls above it might let moisture in to condense.  So, it could be an atmospheric condenser when the humidity is high.

The mention plastics, but actually most of the problems with microplastics are from car tires, and clothing.  The Shade balls would not cause that much trouble I think.

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Now that I think of it, hot humid climates might do ok with this as well.  In such climates heating for homes is not much wanted, but industrial heat would be.  In such climates the condensation in the shade balls should be rather high.

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Of course, Pluto might be such a target as well.

I just viewed a video that indicated that at times Pluto may have an atmospheric pressure of 280 millibar, almost enough to not require a pressure suit.

Geothermal does not seem so sure an energy source, but maybe.  There may be cryo-volcanism.

The planet has lots of Nitrogen and also Methane.  So, if an atmosphere could be inflated with heat from a source such as fusion or even beamed power.

And then floating buildings filled with Methane might work to have flotation in a Nitrogen atmosphere.

I am not sure that Pluto can hold on to its Nitrogen, but it appears to have much of it.  Perhaps an artificial magnetic field might help retain atmosphere.

If Pluto, then did have a substantial atmosphere, then like Titan, SSTO spacecraft with air braking might work very well.

So, on small worlds with Nitrogen and Methane this scheme might work well. 

If the Methane filled buildings would be heated by waste heat from data centers, how massive would be the compute of all of these little worlds.

Where might humans fit into such a thing?

Here is that video: https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/r … ORM=WRVORC  Quote:

A wild idea I have about "Outer" worlds, is that they may still be collecting radioactive materials from space periodically, which may allow them to keep interior liquid oceans.  Easily I could be wrong, but who knows for sure?

If they can reach Earth, then why not Pluto and Eris?

https://phys.org/news/2023-02-radioacti … rnova.html
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And I will make an argument that rogue worlds may be periodically resupplied with new radioactive substances from cosmic violences.  So, it may be that some worlds live on for a very long time even in the eternal darkness with stars.

So then if a world could have an atmosphere like Titan, then even better.

I am thinking that this is the sort of floating building on stilts that could be possible on a world like Titan, or even other worlds if you could inflate a Nitrogen atmosphere.

When Titan's atmosphere is so tall, then the building might be very large, mile of km, whatever pleases you.  Larger is likely a good plan.  The green methane envelope can serve as a radiator, or you might conserve heat by heating mostly the air volume.

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If Titan would work out the way I would hope, as in this topic, then the question is if any other Dwarf Worlds, can be developed in similar ways.  Unfortunately, it is probably like this to project the future, but still it is a desire to try: https://www.mopop.org/sffhof/a-trip-to-the-moon
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Eris then: https://science.nasa.gov/dwarf-planets/eris/
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There is a globe-map inside of the article that you can drag with a cursor.

It seems possible that Eris may have geothermal energy: https://www.sciencetimes.com/articles/4 … kemake.htm
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So, Eris may have that in common with Titan.

Also, it may host an atmosphere of Nitrogen and Methane, when closer to the sun.  So, with an increased energy input it might be made to have that in common with Titan.

I think if Fusion were a real thing, then perhaps such an atmosphere could be inflated.

It would be nice to think that one of the methods being tried will eventually work.  But we already know that a Hydrogen bomb(s) would work.  They are just dangerous and messy.

A bit like the spaceship drive Orion, I wonder about a shell well insulated large enough that you could trigger hydrogen bombs inside of it.  If it was vacuum inside, then the possibility of a shell that can absorb the energy may be considered.  Otherwise, one small sea on Eris itself might host such explosions.

Here is a device that converts gamma rays from nuclear waste to visible light and then uses solar cells to make electricity: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technolo … r-AA1zOPZV
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So, this invention is only scaled to power a microchip, but it hints at some larger process that could eventually be invented.

A star emits gamma rays, and then the Hydrogen, Helium and other matter is heated by it.

So, perhaps a hollow shell could be charged by nuclear explosions.  Perhaps for some time after a charge to emit gamma rays to then be converted to light and then if desired to electricity.

Perhaps the explosions could create something like Aluminum-26.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium-26
I think that Aluminum 26 is created from another element, by radiation, but don't recall which.

So, anyway maybe there could be a way to charge a shell of materials, with isotopes that would decay, using a Hydrogen Bomb(s).  This then would be like a giant battery.  And rather than using gamma rays to heat up a substance for a reactor, the gamma rays could be converted to light, and then if desired into electricity.

So, even if the bombs were flashes in the dark, the battery would give a smoother output of energy.

Sort of an artificial hollow mini-sun.

Once you were out beyond the heliopause, then it might be that Deuterium and Helium 3 could be harvested from the interstellar medium.  Small Rogue planets might even collect those things.

Getting metals on Eris is a question mark.  However, I think that solar sails from the inner system could bombard the little worlds atmosphere and so put what is needed onto the surface.  In reality cosmic dust must have been accumulating over long time anyway, and "Might" be available near the surface.

So, who knows maybe an assortment of similar tiny worlds might exist out into the Oort Cloud(s), and dwarf world hopping might be the way of expansion to other star systems.

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Flotation may offer a method to concentrate the Oxides of Iron, at the other end of the scheme:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a … 1616300229
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I only ever observed experiments with floatation.

And Hydrogen can be creating by causing Iron to rust at high temperatures: https://www.wevolver.com/article/iron-b … en-storage
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So, of course you would not want to have process, just to be impressive in technology.

What I am wondering about is:
1) Reduce regolith, by mixing Algae into the fine ore, and use pyrolysis, perhaps solar to reduce the Mass.  My guess is that the result might have impurities in it.
2) Do a magnetic separation.
3) Oxidize the magnetic part, using hot steam to create Hydrogen.
4) Possibly do a Floatation separation.
5) Treat the concentrate with heat and Hydrogen to reduce it.
6) Magnetically separate.

Granted excessive steps would be an expense.  But it seems that normal Mars regolith is close to being a lean ore.  And if some of it is naturally fine, you might avoid as much crushing process, just screen the stuff and process.

This is just guesswork, but it does suggest a set of tools, that might be used to get the Iron concentration high enough to be worth the final process to Pig Iron.

Just some guesswork.

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Well, be careful I might be a Quack-Quack.   If feel a bit like I am an alchemist, as really, I only have a partial grasp of what I am attempting.

We don't build bogs to make Iron ore, but bogs do make a form of it.  As I go down the rabbit hole on this one, I find that Iron does a lot of strange things.  As far as Iron in solutions and precipitations for solutions, I mostly find references to Iron in drinking water.

But the Bog example exists, and just vaguely mentions how Iron in the ground water upon reaching Oxygen changes to a different Oxidation which is not soluble in water.  It does not say how the soluble Iron gets into the water from sediments.

For Lake Vida there is a bit more information.  It can be asked about Iron in Lake Vida, or Hydrogen in Lake Vida.

Iron: https://link.springer.com/article/10.10 … 017-0346-5

Hydrogen/Nitrous Oxide: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ancient-li … ctic-lake/
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So, I am doing a presumption that if you washed the salts including the Perchlorates out of the fine soil portion of regolith and mix that with organic materials and subject it to Pyrolysis you might reduce some of the materials such as Iron.  I am presuming that this could help forms of Iron to dissolve out of the result.  The result may need to be crushed though, which is an extra effort, and any Carbon left behind may be hard for biology to access due to the results of Pyrolysis.  A hope is that this material sprinkled on the bottom of a Lake/Canal, might both provide dissolved metals such as forms of Iron, and perhaps promote the formation of Hydrogen.

The Lake/Canal bottoms can be considerably warmer than the -13 C of Lake Vida, so the reactions if any will go faster, I hope.  In such Lakes/Canals, a warm bottom water would be anoxic and covered with a cool/cold water layer above it which may be Oxidizing but might not be.  This is to be accomplished using salt graduations, to disable thermal convection, mixing of water.

One thing in the back of my mind is if you can dissolve metals into a brine, can you electroplate them out of the brine?  Far more is unknown on that.

So, you do the Pyrolysis thing and then crush the results and dump it into anoxic water to dissolve Iron and perhaps other things, then you might attempt to electroplate Iron out of it?  But other substances might result, so I am extremely unsure.

Otherwise, a Bog simulation might provide some form of bog iron.  Anoxic brine with dissolved Iron exposed to Oxygen will precipitate Iron Oxide out of it.

As for the gainful production of Hydrogen, from metals in brine, I don't know if such a reaction would be economic in volume.  But though a slow process a system of lakes and canals could be very large.

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Electroplating with Iron????

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti … with-iron/

Electrodeposition of Iron and Iron Alloys:
https://www.lenr-forum.com/attachment/1 … lloys-pdf/

My brain is full (Of it).

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Thank You for your help to learn Dr. Johnson.

I do recall though that the severe greenhouse effect of Venus is not just by CO2, but by a broad mixture of substances, each which block a specific wavelength.  I think also that in the case of Venus much heat may come from the heat of the planet, not just the sun.  The planet itself glows a dim red.

But I will wait to see things about saturation elaborated on proved or disproved.

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I am going somewhat off track Calliban, but perhaps onto a path that is essential, I hope.

While humans seem too often have an unconscious impulse to procreate and then continue pattern beyond their life spans, it seems most likely that line of pattern will eventually end and be replaced by "Superior?" or non-living pattern.

Will the Neanderthals thank us if we wake them from the sleep of death?

And yes, that is the dark thing.  In the end though, nature favors those who have faith, hope, and love.  That is, continuation of pattern seems to be what is appropriate.  It is a sort of "Might-As-Well" thing, and requires some courage actually, that we do not waste our time here.

I speak as a male as I am identified as a male by structure and habit.  And so, I speak more about males, as I know quite a bit less about what it is to be female.

I do think I know this recent thing I have read, that an apparent female love of here children is actually genetic perpetuation instinct.  And it is now wrong, it is highly adaptive.  It is growth oriented, not decay oriented.

An acquaintance I worked with, saying himself Danish in history by genetics, made a claim that some feminine products are designed to reduce female enjoyment of sex.  So, why would such a thing exist, if it exists?

We do know that the "Woke" crowd absolutely interferes with regenerative breeding.  Why do some corporations support it?  Bud Light, Target tuck friendly underwear for boys?

Is this possibly like the opium trade, to first offer pleasure, and then to damage a person so they cannot enjoy life without a fix?  If it can be presumed that most of us inherit a compulsion to breed, is such perversion from that, going to cause a psychological set of problems, which corporations can claim to solve with a product that can be purchased.

Quite a rabbit hole.  True or imagined?  Well, we know that the game in drugs is to hook a victim into a degenerate pattern that pulls them into a darkness, that thereafter may require "Fixes" as a chance of relief.  And so, can sexuality be messed with the hope of profits for a corporation run by a psychopathic Dominant Man or perhaps woman?

I do not have proof, but it is greatly suspicious as to why corporations are so desiring to support the woke.

And why should I care or should anyone care?  Well, if we live to accomplish something we may hate to see it consumed by the decay of a Satanic human hating force.

If we would want a "Settlement" to prosper as to not be in vain, then we need to find these creatures and end them.

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