New Mars Forums

People are generally pretty scared of being irradiated, nuclear accidents etc.

If my figures are correct on this, It takes around 5-6 months to get to Mars with current chemical rocket technology. People have stayed on the ISS for that long, so it can be done without too much mental or physical damage.

About making robots our slaves -

With increasingly advanced AI, If there were ever a possibilty for Robots or Computer Programs to achieve sentience and self awareness - you can bet it will happen.

Regulations to forbid this will last all of two seconds! Just like there are computer viruses, bot nets, piracy and all forms of digitial crimes - somebody will become curious and lets the machines out of their boundaries.

If China stopped trading with the US tomorrow, your entire economy would collapse. Kablaam! I say quit the bullshit and big moral high horse about China. Most of your goods are already from over there so I fail to see what you're proving through space.

I don't approve of the Chinese government and how that place is run, but I don't see how freezing them out of space co-operation will achieve anything.

I think that democratic reform can happen in China by taking away the hostility and co-operating. We can have more of an influence on the populous by being non threatening. It is becoming more open and that trend is likely to continue.

It will be a big mistake not to co-operate with China in space, because one way or another they are going to get there. They have the resources and soon enough they'll will have the expertise. China will do a deal with the Russians over space, thats very likely. ESA is very likely to co-operate with  Russia also. In the far future, its not that unlikely that ESA will co-operate with China on a space program. If US limits its potential partners in space, It might get its ass kicked when it comes to colonization and economics in space.

I think its really positive that India wants to co-operate in Space exploration. I can only hope for more co-operation.

We can all get there together!!

Well, yeah. The same Xenophobic bullshit as yester year.
You can't tar everybody with one brush!

I'm not entirely blind to what goes on in many Islamic countries but I don't think thats a reason to freeze them out of buisness, trade, science and exploration.

The more we co-operate with them, the more chance we have of being a positive influence on them and their public. The more we threaten them and spread anti-islamic hysteria about, the more those people are likely to rally behind a dictator or a religious extremist.

People in those situations get terrified and are likely to rally behind any crazy cause. After 9/11, the american public was pretty scared so they rallied behind Bush and The Iraq war - even though the pretexts were totally absurd and untruthful.

apparently you have troubles with democracy. you would rather a Tomocracy!

apart from the whacky xenophobic whinging, I'd rather not drag politics into space. What ever country has the expertise I would co-operate with.

I can see how that would work on paper, but nobody has yet built such a rocket yet. It hasn't been proven. NASA is struggling to build something that can even lift 125 tonnes into LEO. If such a tech is developed that can lift a 1000 tonnes, cool!!! I'm for doing this on a big industrial scale.

For the time being, I'm thinking more about how the current Ares tech could be modified to launch people like cargo into LEO, on a kinda space bus. These people caspules would all dock with a ship that ferries 100's of people to Mars but never lands.

The colonist will expect more than a medievil standard of living, or they will not go! Even basic colonies will have a lot of needs. 'Mars Economics' will not justify what you are suggesting practically or economically.

Economies of scale are needed, regardless of planet. I'm not sure you grasp how much energy, materials and trade it requires to make even these basic products - but its fairly considerable.

To justify such a huge energy and material expense, you will need several colonies of over 10 000 people. 

The trend of migration in world has tended to be people moving into cities and away from rural areas - not the otherway around.

They will never use lightbulbs on Mars because its going to be a dead technology and it makes more sense to ship and produce LEDs...

EDIT: I roughly worked it out and an Ares V type ship could deliver around 400 000 LED Bulbs to Mars. Each these bulbs last around 5-6 years and uses a meager 3W.

If you want to use Solar Power on Mars, Incandecsent bulbs are really bad because they consume 95% of their electricity producing heat. They're really wasteful.

'Democratic' nations don't launch wars on each other these days mostly due to the fact that the means of destruction are so great they would cause mutually assured destruction aswell as destroying trade and economy..

'Democratic' nations however have no problem with picking on third world countires who don't really have the means to fight back.

What is really at the heart of these state's actions is money. Buisness interests call the shots in so-called 'democratic' countries. The common thread betwen such states are multi-national corporations, not democracy

would that lower the metabolism of the passengers?

Like putting them into a deep sleep could avoid some of the problems of 'cabin fever' in a six month + journey through mostly featureless space but we're trying to lower their food consumption to an absolute minmal - like hibernating animals do on Earth.

Another idea I have been toying a round with is a Large Modular Vehicle that does regular trips between Mars and Earth Orbit, but doesn't land on either planet.

Smaller craft launched of Ares type rockets would bring people up to it over a period of a few days from the surface of either planet.

These small people carrying craft would not need to bring many supplies up, just the people.

A seperate supplies craft would stock up the ship for a six month journey.

The smaller craft would serve would be used to depart and land on the surface of either planet (like Soyuz capsule)

The smaller craft would also be used to extend the living space of the over all vehicle.

This ship

We'll need a craft with the ability to launch atleast 20 humans off the Earth's surface in one go, probably more though.

Seeing the large payloads capable by the Ares I+V, I don't think propulsion is that much of an issue. Its keeping all those people alive for the transit. That requires a lot of consumables.

If we could find a way to put these people into hibernation-like state for the journey, it could reduce the amount of food needed. Water and Oxygen can probably by recycled. I think we would need some very powerful drugs and life support machines to achieve this.

Putting the crew into an extended deep sleep might mitigate some of the psychological problems of the journey.

I think producing some rocket fuel and supplies on the moon could help.

Oh please!

Look, I've plenty off muslim friends. They happen to have a thing called common sense.

If the example you used were true, Muslim countries couldn't have airports. Oddly enough, they're quite pragmatic people.

lol