New Mars Forums

Talk about life causing the dark bands that only show up in UV light has been around for a while. I forget which probe discover it. I have seen it mentioned in a couple of science fiction books. I didn’t know it was still being discussed last year. I guess they still have not found a satisfactory non-biological explanation.

If there microbes in the upper atmosphere, how did they get there. Did Venus once have a watery past? I read an Astronomy Article years ago that said Venus briefly had oceans of water way back in its past. Could they have evolved back then and survived all these years?

Could they have come from rocks blasted off the Earth by imp actors? Such meteors might burst in Venus’ upper atmosphere, scattering any bacteria that was in it. Could bacteria survive such a journey?

Frost is possible, but I don't think it would last long during the day. It tends to quickly evaporate in the dry air. It could always form again the next night.

One of the Vikings observed frost on the surface.

I read this article in Astronomy Magazine many years ago. I am glad to see it on the internet. It is one of my favorite Astronomy articles.

[http://homepage.sunrise.ch/homepage/sch … tauri.html]http://homepage.sunrise.ch/homepage/sch … tauri.html

There could be up to 4 (Unlikely but possible) habitable planets in the Alpha Centauri system. If you placed the Solar System around Alpha Centauri A, Earth and Mars would be in the Life-zone. If you placed our Solar System Around Alpha Centauri B, Venus and Earth would be in the Life-zone.

I do disagree with the Author about Alpha Centauri C and Red Giants. Would shouldn’t write them off yet. They may surprise us, just like Europa’s possible ocean surprised us.

Antarctica and India meteorites linked to the same origins as Bounce. Bounce came from elsewhere on Mars than the region around Eagle Crater.

Check out the end of this press release;
[http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/ … 0414a.html]http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery....4a.html

'Bounce' and Shergotty Share Common Ground

This illustration compares the light signature or spectrum of "Bounce," a rock at Meridiani Planum, to that of a martian meteorite found on Earth called Shergotty. Bounce's spectrum, and thus mineral composition, is unique to the rocks studies so far at Merdiani Planum and Gusev Crater, the landings sites of the Mars Exploration Rovers Opportunity and Spirit. However, the results here indicate that Bounce is not a one-of-a-kind rock, but shares origins with Shergotty. Shergotty landed in India in 1865. Bounce's spectra were taken on sol 67 by Opportunity's Moessbauer spectrometer.

And

Meteorite Linked to Rock at Meridiani

This meteorite, a basalt lava rock nearly indistinguishable from many Earth rocks, provided the first strong proof that meteorites could come from Mars. Originally weighing nearly 8 kilograms (17.6 pounds), it was collected in 1979 in the Elephant Moraine area of Antarctica. The side of the cube at the lower left in this image measures 1 centimeter (0.4 inches).

This picture shows a sawn face of this fine-grained gray rock. (The vertical stripes are saw marks.) The black patches in the rock are melted rock, or glass, formed when a large meteorite hit Mars near the rock. The meteorite impact probably threw this rock, dubbed "EETA79001," off Mars and toward Antarctica on Earth. The black glass contains traces of martian atmosphere gases.

The Mars Exploration Rover Opportunity has discovered that a rock dubbed "Bounce" at Meridiani Planum has a very similar mineral composition to this meteorite and likely shares common origins. Bounce itself is thought to have originated outside the area surrounding Opportunity's landing site; an impact or collision likely threw the rock away from its primary home.

I have read more than one science article (I think one was in Discover Magazine) that the Earth looses water in space because the sunlight will break down water into oxygen and hydrogen. However the rate loss is compensated by comets so that there is no net loss.

Considering this, and the possibility comets may have deposited water ice at the Moons poles, and Mercury’s poles, then Mars probably get replenished with water from comets.

Too bad that comet that hit Jupiter a few years ago didn’t hit Mars.

bolbuyk, I don't know what a safe range would be for asteroids. It would need to be in a stable cycle, and there would need to be all kinds of fail-safe plans in case it was ever a threat to Earth, Mars or the Moon.

Earthfirst, Flooding parts of the Sahara with the Mediterranean is not a bad idea. It might help lower the total seal level some.

I have thought about pumping seawater into central Antarctica to lower the sea level. Doing so would help increase the total land area of the Earth. For example, here in Texas, during the last couple of Ice Ages, the coast was over 100 miles downriver from where it is today.

I guess the whole list was too big to post. You can see an example, anyway.

The list coveres the Alpha Centauri Systems (All three stars)

The Solar System looks like this;

I. The Solar System        US/2295                 8,331,116,750
    A.*Earth            UNSA/2054  7,347,790,120  7,347,790,120
    B. Mars             UNSA/2177     98,281,290     98,366,210
         1. Phobos      Mars/2231         73,540               
         2. Deimos      Mars/2271         11,380               
    C. Mercury          UNSA/2248      2,322,760      2,322,760
    D. Ganymede         UNSA/2248      5,726,020      9,510,480
         1. Callisto    Gany/2251      2,906,910
         2. Europa      Gany/2253        824,210
         3. Io          Gany/2253         16,290
         4. Thebe       Gany/2261         23,270
         5. Himalia     Gany/2264          4,620
         6. Lysithea    Gany/2265          1,530
         7. Elara       Gany/2279          6,940
         8. Leda        Gany/2291            690
    E. Ceres            UNSA/2253        272,510        469,170
         1. Vesta       Cere/2262         40,030
         2. Pallas      Cere/2262         12,180
         3. Hygia       Cere/2266         19,620
         4. Davida      Cere/2271          2,570
         5. Interamnia  Cere/2271         79,720
         6. Eunomia     Cere/2271          7,140
         7. Sylvia      Cere/2271          1,820
         8. Cybele      Cere/2271            730
         9. Juno        Cere/2277         23,780
        10. Bamberga    Cere/2277          1,040
        11. Herculina   Cere/2278          3,340
        12. Patientia   Cere/2283            800
        13. Thalia      Cere/2289            260
        14. Mathilde    Cere/2295          3,630
    F. Venus            UNSA/2270     52,639,280     52,639,280
    G. Moon             UNSA/2271    811,839,880    811,839,880
    H. Titan            UNSA/2274      8,040,820      8,091,070
         1. Rhea        Tita/2274         15,370
         2. Iapetus     Tita/2275          3,000
         3. Dione       Tita/2278          9,300
         4. Tethys      Tita/2281          2,790
         5. Enceladus   Tita/2286         11,040
         6. Mimas       Tita/2287          6,270
         7. Hyperion    Tita/2291            380
         8. Janus       Tita/2295          1,410
         9. Pandora     Tita/2295            690
    I. Triton           UNSA/2284         33,410         40,950
         1. Pluto       Trit/2285          4,570
         2. Chiron      Trit/2285          1,040
         3. Nereid      Trit/2287            920
         4. Proteus     Trit/2290            730
         5. Thalassa    Trit/2293            280
    J. Miranda          UNSA/2288         16,830         46,830
         1. Oberon      Mira/2288          7,660
         2. Umbriel     Mira/2288          3,570
         3. Ariel       Mira/2289          2,190
         4. Titania     Mira/2290         14,920
         5. Cordelia    Mira/2290            620
         6. Portia      Mira/2293            190
         7. Cressida    Mira/2294            850

How would spring water react when exposed to Mars current environment?

It depends somewhat on the area of Mars we are talking about. In the Hellas Basin, on a warm summer day, water could exist for a long time.

But for most of Mars, here is what I think would happen.

Some of it would boil and evaporate in the thin dry Mars air and some would freeze(and evaporate later). But if the water source was large enough for the spring to stay active awhile, it would overfill the spring and flow, cutting channels as it goes. A layer of ice would form over the channel, slowing the evaporation of the water.

Once the water source was deplenished, the water would stop flowing ice covering the channel would evaporate, leaving dry channels.

Humans have had an effect on the Earth’s climate, but then again, life has always effected the climate. Early life added oxygen to the Earth’s Atmosphere. But Mother Nature has us all beat. She has caused ice ages and warm periods. She has caused the sea level to rise and fall. One thing that has been constant about the Earth’s Climate is that it is always changing. I sometimes wonder if we really have as big of impact as we think.

As our knowledge of the Earth’s climate and weather improve, and as our technology advances, I think the human race will take control of the Earth’s climate and weather. It might come after Mars and Venus is terraformed. Sooner or later, thou, the Sun is going to get uncomfortably warmer (a normal part of its aging) and our descendants will have to do something if they want to keep the Earth habitable.

The key to controlling the Earth’s climate and weather is controlling the amount of solar radiation reaching the Earth. This can be done from orbit, using similar tools needed to terraform Venus. Perhaps some sort of solar shade that can let various amounts of sunlight through, on any given area on it.

For example, one spot on the shade is not letting any light through, to cast a shadow on a hurricane and kill it. Another part it letting 70% light through to cool off an area in a drought. Orbital lenses and mirrors might be helpful as well. An orbital lense could be used to increase water vapor by evaporating ocean water. It could also be used to warm frozen areas and to help grow crops in places like Sibera. Mirrors could also help crops by extending daylight hours over farmland.

Chat, I see two ways we could build at the atomic level using the resources of a planet, asteroid or moon.

The first way is to follow the examples of a plant. A plant starts out as a seed. This seed digs roots into the ground. The root find and transport the right atoms to build a plant. A mature apple tree knows how to take atoms out of the ground to build an apple. This is all encoded on its DNA. Imagine sending seeds (Mechanical or biological) to an asteroid. This seed sends roots throughout the asteroid and starts making whatever we have programmed it to make.

The second way works a little differently to achieve the same results. Let’s build an apple, but we are not going to use DNA to tell us how to build it. Let’s map out every atom in the apple in a 3-D map. We’ll note the location and type of every atom in the apple. Then we’ll collect the atoms we need to build an exact copy (Using mechanical roots or nanobots). All that is left is to put each atom in its correct location, following the atomic map, and we have an exact copy of the atom.

To be able to send a seed to a planet, moon, or asteroid, and have it build, say a fully stocked base (or whatever we wanted) would be a tremendous step for the human race. To be able to map and build things at the atomic level would be an even greater step. Space exploration, colonization and terraforming would become so much easier.

First of all, has this topic been discussed before, here? I couldn't find a thread on it, but I hate to start a new one if it has.

In my story, "War Against Gravity," set 200 years in our future, the Sahara had been 'terraformed,' into a rainforest. The Gobi and central desert of Australia had also been terraformed.

To do this, orbital lenses evaporated vast amounts of sea water up wind of the deserts. Over time, dense forest grew and locked in water. Also, great aquifers were created.

Orbital lenses may not be practical. Perhaps we could turn vast amounts of sea water into freshwater (Using Solar Power, of course) and pump it to these deserts (using pipes, much like we do for oil). I believe that eventually a large rainforest would lock in water locally so that a wet climate would remain stable without having to pump in more water.

The timeframe I am envisioning is just over a hundred years to get a stable rainforest. (Maybe sooner if it was aggressively pursued)