New Mars Forums

I agree, Phobos. Those truncated pie-slice bedrooms sound downright palatial compared to what I'd imagined!
   I think I could cope quite nicely with quarters like that for a couple of years. Very cosy, in fact!
   When do we leave?!
                                       

Josh, you've got me worried about this Martian magnetic field thing!
   In recent years, I had accepted that the only field on Mars was a patchy, remnant, crustal field. But lately, in reading through one or two websites, I've been getting the impression that I was wrong.
   My current understanding is that there is an extremely weak global field of 1/800th to maybe 1/500th the strength of Earth's field. Superimposed on this, are the crustal remnants of a previously much stronger global field which is assumed to have existed early in the planet's history. Apparently, in some places, the remnant fields are still nearly equal to Earth's current global field, though most are weaker.
   Now, I may well be misinterpreting what I've been browsing through, and I'm ready and willing to be corrected. In fact, if anyone has the 'low-down' on the latest data about Mars' magnetic field, I'm all ears!!
                                       

P.S. It's just occurred to me, since Mars appears to have had polarity reversals in the past, that maybe we've caught her in the middle of one right now.
      When Earth has a polarity reversal, there is a time period in the middle when there is little or no field at all to speak of. What if Mars normally has a quite respectable global magnetic field? .... Maybe not anything like Earth's strength of course, but respectable just the same. It could be we're seeing it at just the wrong time!
       I know, probability is against us showing up at just the wrong moment. But it can happen. Look at how Mariner 9 arrived in orbit around Mars in 1971, in the middle of a planetwide dust storm!
       As Confucius say: "S**t happens!"

A very warm welcome to New Mars, Jeff!
   You have put forward some very pertinent and interesting points. It's always a pleasure to have a different viewpoint on these matters.
   I don't get involved in future Martian politics very much. It's as much as I can do just to keep up with Terran politics!!
   However, I'm sure you will get some quality feedback from a few of our resident politicians in due course.
   Good to have you aboard!
                                         

You may be interested to know that Richard Hoagland and his intrepid band of Face enthusiasts are working overtime!
   They are analysing new IR pictures of the Cydonia region, which they believe will finally provide unequivocal proof of artificiality. They believe NASA is on the back foot over this and scrambling to initiate urgent damage control.
   Apparently there is an informant at NASA who has been keeping Richard and company supplied with 'inside information', and s/he maintains that the top brass is very disturbed at the prospect of premature full-disclosure to the public.
   One NASA employee (at least I infer he works for NASA) has intimated he has tampered with the data Hoagland is working on, and it is therefore invalid. If the data HAS NOT been tampered with, why would a NASA employee suggest that it had? If it HAS been tampered with, why would a NASA employee do such a thing? In any event there are now vague indications from the Hoagland camp that legal action will be taken if the assertions of tampering are adhered to, because it is probably illegal to alter data gathered for the public using public funding, with the intention to mislead.
   This is all terribly exciting stuff ... if you can believe any of it! It seems that all will be revealed as of August 29th (next week), unless Richard Hoagland has an unfortunate accident between now and then!!
   I can't wait!
   What? .... No, not for the accident, silly ... for the information!!
                                           

Hi Josh!
           It looks like polarity reversals were quite common on Mars, at least during its early history.
           Earth has a polarity reversal about every million years or so. And, although there is some evidence of increased extinction rates at these times, most species seem to weather the change without too much trouble.
           One of the best places to see evidence of Earth's magnetic reversals is at the mid-Atlantic ridge, a tectonic plate boundary where magma pushes up to the surface from deep inside the planet. New crust is thus created and, as a result, Africa and South America are getting farther apart by a few inches each year. The fresh lava assumes the magnetic polarity of the Earth at the time it surfaces and "freezes" (or solidifies) in the ocean depths. So, each side of the ridge, we see "stripes" of relatively new crust with alternating north and south magnetisation, in accordance with Earth's polarity at the time of formation.
           Cindy's August 19th post gave a website with the title: Earth's North Magnetic Pole. If you access this site and go to the May 4th 1999 picture, you will see remnant magnetic striping in the crust of Mars. The satellite which made the measurements was passing over the terrain in a north-south mapping mode as the planet revolved beneath it. But the magnetic stripes, revealed in different false colours, are easily discerned lying in an east-west orientation.
            This is incredible stuff! It looks like incontrovertible proof that Mars, at least in its early days, had plate tectonics like Earth! This contrasts completely with recently held views that the crust of Mars has always been a "monoplate" ... a single monolithic and unmoving shell. It also indicates two more things: An erstwhile energetically-churning hot interior, and lots of water. (Water is the lubricant that allows crustal plates to move relative to one another.) It also indicates, at least to me, that our understanding of the history and geology of Mars is almost nil! The more we learn, the more confusing and enigmatic Mars becomes. It's a fantastic place!!
           But, if Mars had life in its younger days (and my personal opinion is that it did), the polarity reversals it apparently experienced would have been unlikely to kill it off. We've had at least as many such events here on Earth, but life carries on regardless.
           Cindy, yes! The Martian crustal magnetic field is patchy. It's really quite strong in some areas ... strong enough to reach up high above the surface and actually shield the atmosphere from solar wind "erosion", called sputtering. While in other regions it is very weak.
            Actually Josh, I believe now that Mars does have a global magnetic field, though very much weaker than Earth's. This is an important point because relatively young lava flows have been identified on Mars. In fact, they're so young that they might have occurred only thousands of years ago! Though figures of up to ten million years are also possible. In either case, it means Mars must still be volcanically active. And this would tie in with the magnetic field evidence, since it is believed that a molten interior is associated with the production of a magnetic field.
           All this makes me think Mars is a dynamic place. At the moment it's sleeping and appears quite dull. But I suspect all of its spectacular activity is not necessarily confined to its halcyon past! I think it's a place of cyclical activity and anything could happen.
           Wouldn't it be mind-numbing if Odyssey or Global Surveyor were right there when one of those amazing volcanoes decided to erupt?! It might even cause a major climatic change for the better ... a real kick-start for terraforming!
           Well! ... I can dream, can't I?!!     

Hi Cindy and Bill !
   "A Man On The Moon" by Andrew Chaikin is my bible on this subject.
   Even if you don't want to plough through its full 600 pages, it offers a wealth of detail on a particularly interesting chapter in America's history. It's a worthwhile addition to any home reference library.
                                 

I tend to agree with much of what Clark has just said. Human history is indeed full of conflict over inequality. It's also full of conflict stemming from greed and power-hunger ... which then results in a conflict to reverse the inequalities resulting from that!! A seemingly unending chaos of unrest and violence. (No wonder all those aliens have eschewed the idea of open contact ... Land on the Whitehouse lawn? And get shot at by security guards? ... I don't think so!! ) 
   Cindy has very eloquently said what I have been trying to say! How right she is in her assessment of the talent differential between the generations. What went before is no indication of what to expect in the future. The genetic system is just too complex and the available combinations when two gene pools mingle at conception is immense. But then, as she goes on to say, quite rightly in my view, we are not just puppets. A quote from a movie whose title I can't recall just came to mind: "Nature is what mankind was put on Earth to rise above!"  (That was it! Katherine Hepburn in "The African Queen". ) There is such a thing as free will and we don't all have to slavishly follow our more primitive instincts.
   Phobos makes another excellent point when he states the danger of forcibly trying to control our "wilder" side. Human nature seems like the proverbial pile of marbles ... the more you try to gather them into one orderly group, the more they slip through your fingers and roll off in all directions!
   Human behaviour is simply uncontainable because of its unpredictability. But that's what makes us special. And, in as much as you can't have good without evil, if you want those occasional exceptional talents who inspire the whole race to higher achievements, you have to accept that those occasional antisocial misfits and misanthropes will come along too!
   It's the price you have to pay for being human ... here or anywhere else in the solar system, as Bill quite rightly says.
                                 ???

I must be living in a time warp or something, but believe it or not, this is the first I've heard of sulfur lamps! And I'm ashamed to admit it because I'd always imagined myself as being reasonably up to date on new technologies.
   A nagging concern about Martian colonisation in the recesses of my mind has always been light intensity and potential depression from the dimness of everyday sunshine.
   This light source will surely go a long way towards alleviating or even eliminating the problem.
   Thanks, Bill, for dragging me into the 21st century! At last, I've seen the light!! (Sorry! )
                                           

Sorry, C.M. !
   I hadn't heard about that.
   Incidentally, the latest Mel Gibson movie, "Signs", is a horror/sci-fi story involving crop circles.

Hi Clark!
   Here in Australia, we remain untroubled by a "Patriot Act", a "War Powers Act", and the flying of Confederate flags on government buildings.
   I assume the two Acts are related to the war on terrorism and must somehow curtail individual liberties(? ). No doubt many aspects of these Acts must be unpopular if they interfere with personal freedoms. In a sense, this reflects what I mentioned about the possible advantages of fascism in times of external danger to a state. These Acts are possibly fascist to some extent in that they are designed, I imagine, to strengthen the ability of the state to defend itself from attack.
   You are right to question such Acts, since a little bit of fascism tends to lead to a lot of fascism! And we know where that road can take us! But a little fascism is deemed appropriate by most states which find themselves threatened because it enhances the ability to fight back. Nevertheless, implementing such measures is playing with fire and I agree with you that drawing the line is very difficult.
   I assume the reference to the Confederate flag relates to its association with a state which condoned slavery. Within America, such a symbol would probably be inflammatory to some sections of society and, for this reason, displaying it on public buildings sounds inappropriate. Here in Australia, some motorcycle gangs use it on their jackets as a symbol of rebellion. Most of them probably wouldn't know a thing about its history.
   Derogatory names for native Americans or hispanics are undoubtedly hurtful and inevitably counterproductive. Such names exist here too, for aboriginal Australians. A bad thing all round, based on ignorance and a primitive fear of anything "other".
   As for the Taiwan conundrum ... you've got me there! But there must be a way to avoid such antagonisms if we think hard enough about them. What can you suggest, Clark?
                                       

Cindy: "Again, you got your arse bit in the process."

   Please excuse this totally off-topic question but I thought that all Americans used the term "ass" rather than "arse". You know, as in "let's kick ass!"
   I'm intrigued that you used what I always thought was a more anglo-celtic form.
   Have I been labouring under a misapprehension that all Americans use the term "ass"?

   Again ... apologies for this side-tracking !
   I'm genuinely curious.
                                           

Ha-ha!! ... "set that sucker on the spin cycle" ...   
   I love it!
   Thanks for the amusing terminology and thanks for casting your vote for artificial gravity.