Fixing Americas car industry

SpaceNut · 2023-05-03 19:27:20

Here is some more of what makes todays car the way that they are.

Where the Energy Goes: Gasoline Vehicles

A car using gasoline will create from 1 gallon or 6.3 lbs of fuel, 20 lbs of co2 from an approximate 14.7 ration to 1 of which if we had to carry the mass of atmosphere to burn the fuel makes for 23.22 lbs of oxygen is required. To which the total 100 lbs of air is just for that 1 gallon. Now fill the tank up for range and you now have something that will be why conversion to other source of energy is a challenge.

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-05-26 03:20:48

Whistleblower Drops 100 Gigabytes Of Tesla Secrets To German News Site: Report

https://jalopnik.com/whistleblower-drop … 1850476542

German authorities looking into possible data protection violations by Tesla, newspaper reports

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/05/26/authori … tions.html

SpaceNut · 2023-06-13 22:17:11

Solar trees offer unique solution to charging electric cars

SolarBotanic Trees, which was founded last year, is developing two different sized versions of the tree, one 5.5 metres tall tree and another 3.5 metres tall, with the first installations planned for early next year in Oxford.

https://www.autoweek.com/news/green-car … -off-grid/

solarbotanic-1663767408.jpg?crop=1.00xw:1.00xh;0,0&resize=1200:*

A little more realistic

Mars_B4_Moon · 2023-07-03 03:47:44

Fire chief warns against ‘unleashing’ self-driving taxis in San Francisco - Driverless cars are becoming a nuisance for the department as they appear to obstruct fire engines and block roads in emergencies

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 … -francisco

tahanson43206 · 2023-07-03 07:01:54

For Mars_B4_Moon re #329

Thanks for providing the link about the need for driverless cars to interface with emergency services.

Your summary ahead of the link is what I am working from in this post.

Based upon the summary provided by Mars_B4_Moon, and without having read details from the link itself, I conclude that since emergency services are part of the environment in which driverless cars must operate, manufacturers are going to need to develop such an interface. Of equal importance is the need for the government agency in the jurisdiction of which a driverless car must operate to invest in the corresponding interface technology.

This is a challenge government agencies have attempted to meet in the past, when the customers were humans. Government agencies have implemented radio broadcast services which interrupt commercial broadcasts on AM, FM, TV and lately cable TV. A possible solution is for government agencies and driverless automobile manufacturers to use any or all of the existing channels, and adapt the messages for the AI system in the vehicle.

This is going to be a non-trivial problem, so I expect it will require congressional oversight and financial support.

Thanks again to Mars_B4_Moon for bringing the problem to our attention.

Update: A driverless vehicle (such as a truck) that needs to cross multiple jurisdictions must be able to interface with the traffic control systems of all the jurisdictions. The air traffic control system in place in the United States (and most countries) is a model for what is needed.

(th)

SpaceNut · 2023-08-05 15:10:49

My Cheap Electric Go-Kart Is Better Than Ever—and Now You Can Build It Too AA1ccUrE.img?w=534&h=300&m=6

kbd512 · 2023-08-05 16:20:57

SpaceNut,

That thing has no suspension, what looks to be one of those plastic seats we sat on in grammar school, and the battery is held in with zip ties, but it still cost this Peter Holderith fellow who built it, $800?

Docyke Electric Go Kart Kit Constructibles Over 15 Electric Vehicles Battery Powered for Boys and Girls Kids Electric Ride on Cars Best Gifts for 5 to 18 Year Old Kids

Exactly $800, but it looks like a properly engineered electric go-kart with real suspension, brakes, etc, except that it uses 2 to 4 of Dad's electric drill batteries to power it. Call me crazy, but if I spend $800 on an electric go-kart, I won't be doing what Mr. Holderith did.

SpaceNut · 2023-08-05 16:23:24

I agree that the 81QNsgDpkWL._AC_SL1500_.jpg is much better.

you start with the pedal kit that is 699

71VBsTUY83L._AC_SL1500_.jpg

then you add the electrical for 499

71jU885l1xL._AC_SL1500_.jpg

SpaceNut · 2023-12-01 19:31:53

How Uni Wheel Drive Systems Could Radically Change EVs Forever

AA1kRewo.img?w=534&h=300&m=6
Universal Wheel Drive System is a hub motor design

kbd512 · 2023-12-02 02:04:21

SpaceNut,

I know we've discussed this before, but all that unsprung weight detracts from ride quality and handling, because only the tire is there to absorb the vibration from the road. This is a very well known physics problem related to motor vehicle suspension systems that no amount of marketing claims are going to solve. Unsprung weight is the reason that most tracked vehicles don't offer better ride quality than most wheeled vehicles. This sort of tech would be better suited to trains than cars and trucks, but even there the electric motors are sprung weight carried by the bogie suspension system.

If you can make the electric motors light enough, then perhaps it's not a massive penalty, but not an improvement in other respects. The interior space claim is overplayed, as is the purported efficiency improvement. Drive shafts are already very efficient. The space between the wheel wells is not going to be used for much else in practice, because the suspension control arms, shocks, and springs have to go somewhere. In actual practice, whether the vehicle is driven by electric motors or a combustion engine and transmission, all the space occupied by the motor and transmission isn't likely to be used for other purposes. Those components and their placement provides structural rigidity and mass to absorb crash / impact energy. After you take all that stuff away, there's only a piece of comparatively flimsy sheet steel between you and another vehicle during a collision, whether from the front or rear, unless you add enough chassis structural weight to negate any weight advantage.

To actually take full advantage of the extra space, you'd have to design an exoskeleton vehicle chassis, which will inevitably have rigidity and/or crash absorption problems. As Elon Musk stated, Tesla found out the hard way with the CyberTruck that it's not easy or intuitive to properly design such a chassis. The CyberTruck prototype chassis suffered from numerous structural failures during testing. They had welds cracking on the chassis and suspension, for example. The only exoskeleton vehicles you typically see are very light F1 cars or super cars made using a monocoque CFRP chassis, like the McLaren F1. Providing that kind of rigidity using sheet metal to support the weight a much heavier passenger car EV will be challenging, to say the least.

I'd like to see how durable a practical mass produced vehicle is before rendering final judgement, but I think the answer should be fairly obvious. A vehicle so-designed is likely to see lots of damaged motors from road vibration, fair ride quality assuming the motors are very light, cracking in places you don't typically see it, and excessive body torsion / sway irreparably damaging the chassis itself over time. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I don't think I will be. I've seen numerous concept cars designed that way- exoskeleton chassis implementations, yet very few ever made it to mass production, and none of them were as durable as traditional unibody or body-on-frame designs.

Calliban · 2023-12-03 07:39:18

Ecomotors was founded in 2008 and was developing very lightweight, opposed-piston diesel engines.
https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2008/10/p … -high.html

The company had plans to build a marketable 100mpg car. This appeared to be a very promissing technology. But it ended up folding and going nowhere. I'm not sure what went wrong exactly. Sometimes companies with good ideas just fail to muster the capital needed to deliver products. Even if the concept is good, it doesn't always guarentee success. This may have been one of those.

SpaceNut · 2023-12-03 12:21:14

Kbd512 if the in hub is used as a single tire drive the support for the tire is like a bike and they contain absorbers on either side of the system to hold it which is the same as the tadpol designs. Changing the support for absorbing the shock of the road can be done.

kbd512 · 2023-12-04 02:03:53

SpaceNut,

If you make the drive tire large enough to provide equivalent traction to a 4-wheeled vehicle so the hub motor can propel the vehicle in the same manner as a 4-wheeled vehicle, then it necessarily becomes larger, heavier, and the handling / ride quality decreases from the unsprung weight in that drive wheel. If there's only one wheel with power going to it, then all the weight and force that would normally be distributed between at least 2 wheels in a normal EV is now directed through a single road wheel and tire. Now you also need 2 different kinds of tires, 2 different kinds of wheels, 2 different kinds of brakes, etc. You haven't reduced design and manufacturing complexity or cost, nor maintenance costs. Sports cars with different front and rear wheel / tire / brake sizes are not less expensive to design / make / maintain than a normal car with the same components on the front and rear, which is why you don't have them on normal road cars. Getting rid of one of the rear wheels by making the remaining one far larger doesn't help matters. I know it looks like it should, but looks are deceiving.

Put another way, cars and trucks have at least 4 wheels because that's the most stable configuration that does the best job of spreading the load, meeting the traction requirements, thus making the vehicle most performant overall, assuming it has to carry a significant load, needs significant power delivered to the ground, and you want good ride quality and handling characteristics.

Think about how racing super bikes perform when compared to F1 cars. Not a single one of them can out-accelerate or out-brake a F-1 car in anything but a straight line, despite often having superior power-to-weight ratios and drastically lower total mass. They lack sufficient tire surface area for the traction required, and also lack the down-force required. Driving over any sort of road course with numerous turns, the lap times of the F1 cars are always faster than the theoretically superior super bikes.

If you can't make a bike or a trike perform equivalently to a car when time and money is no object, then how likely is it to perform better in road cars traversing highly imperfect and poorly maintained roadways, when money and manufacturing complexity / cost becomes a very significant factor?

SpaceNut · 2023-12-17 16:10:43

4 factors contributing to the surge of battery fires in electric cars

SpaceNut · 2023-12-18 09:57:41

These 4 Electric Vehicles Require Costly Maintenance

SpaceNut · 2024-01-15 15:33:33

Much like all things you do not build a home with no off-street parking, a garage to put your vehicle in or a shed for other storage so why would you think that the cold would have no effect on the vehicle is why you are complaining.

EV drivers discover fundamental flaw in car battery tech as -30F temperatures hit the US

EVs come with various benefits, including the fact they are eligible to pay less tax, although that list in shrinking with Feds confirming fewer EVs and hybrids are eligible for 2024 tax credits

So go hybrid and get the ability to be powered by fuel with a block heater if you are parking it outside.

SpaceNut · 2024-01-20 12:16:26

Here's Why Norway Hasn't Had Trouble With Winter EV Charging

SpaceNut · 2024-02-17 12:56:58

Here's How Many Solar Panels You'll Need to Charge Your EV

For the eco-conscious EV driver, an electric vehicle is only as clean and green as the source of electricity charging its battery.
That's because EVs plugged into the grid can either be powered by "dirty" sources such as fossil fuels such as coal, or from "clean" renewable energy that comes from sources such as solar, hydro or wind power. With many utilities, it's likely to be a mix of renewables and fossil fuels. The best way to ensure your EV is actually powered by renewable energy is to connect your home's EV charger to a solar energy system or use a public charger also sourced by solar panels.
With spiking gas and electric prices and an intensifying climate crisis, it's no wonder the solar and electric vehicle industries are gaining in popularity each year. Rooftop solar panel installations are breaking records, and US EV adoption is expected to accelerate -- predicted to reach 40% of passenger car sales by 2030, according to the US Bureau of Labor and Statistics.
Forget the statistics, it's in plain sight and we can't ignore it. EV charging stations are becoming the norm, automakers are making headlines as they invest in new EV technology, and rooftop solar panels are also becoming commonplace to see.
Even with the upswing in EVs and home solar systems, switching from a combustion car to an electric vehicle, however, can be a complicated decision with considerations conventional car drivers don't have to worry about, like installing a charger in your garage. Adding solar panels to the equation adds even more layers of complexity to an already significant investment.
Why use solar panels to charge an electric vehicle (EV)?
There are some less obvious benefits to home solar charging in addition to watching free, clean electrons pulled from the sky streaming into your car's battery.
Most home EV chargers treat your car like any other appliance that needs to be plugged in and charged overnight. Actually, it's more like a quite needy appliance that requires a particular current (DC) and lots of it as quickly as possible, which can mean operating at high voltage.
All of this increases strain on the grid and can add a load to your home's electrical system, especially if your wiring is older or in need of upgrading. In the worst cases of neglect or poor electrical work, it can even be dangerous.
Using solar panels to charge an EV actually streamlines the charging process because both systems speak the same electrical language, in a way.
As Wyldon Fishman, founder of the New York Solar Energy Society, explained, solar panels and electric vehicles both operate with direct current (DC), meaning there's no need to install an inverter between your panels and EV, although a charge controller is still imperative to have in the circuit. DC can also run at lower, safer voltages.
Relying on solar panels rather than the grid to charge your electric vehicle also means not having to worry about being stuck at home with a dead battery if the power goes out, especially if you opt to pair your panels with a battery or other solar storage.
How much energy is needed to charge your EV at home?
First, consider your goals for your solar charging system. Do you want to charge your car using your solar panels, and will you primarily be charging overnight? If so, you're going to need to install a battery or other storage system.
In most cases, you're likely to have a solar system that's hooked into the grid as well as your home, perhaps with a connected battery for emergency backup, or not.
If this is your scenario, it could be helpful to know how much of your existing solar output the rest of your home is consuming. If you never pay a utility bill or your utility bill is primarily for nighttime or cloudy days (when your solar panels aren't at work), this means your existing solar system is probably producing more than you need and the extra is being fed into the grid or a battery or both. Some of this excess energy could be used to charge your EV, meaning you will need fewer solar panels to drive a fully solar-powered car.
Once you've got an idea of whether you're running a solar surplus, the next step is determining how much additional demand an EV will add to your system.
How many solar panels will I need to charge just my EV?
First, consider how much you typically drive in a day. Put simply, the more you drive, the more wattage you're likely to need in panels.
Here's the steps to figuring out how your average daily energy needs to power an EV.
Step 1. Determine how many kilowatt-hours your EV uses per mile. The EPA and US Department of Energy's fueleconomy.gov site lists the estimated efficiency of all electric cars in kWh per 100 miles; simply divide by 100 for a per-mile estimate.
Step 2. Multiply your EV's kWh/mi by the number of miles you anticipate you drive on an average day. (You can get your average daily miles by observing your driving habits for a few days or by dividing your annual observed mileage by 365). This gets you the total number of kilowatt-hours you'll need to produce to power your daily driving.
Step 3. You can then divide the EVs needed kilowatt-hours by the number of peak sun hours you can expect to receive at your location each day.
Step 4. The final figure should give you the size of your ideal EV-charging solar array in kilowatts.
Step 5. To calculate the number of panels you'll need, the wattage of the solar panel comes into play. The most efficient solar panel wattage can range from 370 to 465 watts. After you choose your best solar panel brand, convert the panel wattage of the panel to kilowatts by dividing by 1,000.
Step 6. Final math is to divide the EV kWh requirements by the solar panel efficiency in kWh to get the number of panels needed to charge the EV.
The formula:
kWh/mi for your EV x average miles driven in a day = total kWh production for the EV
Total kWh production needed for EV / local peak sun hours = size of ideal solar system (in kW)
Convert the solar panel wattage of the brand of choice to kilowatts by dividing by 1,000.
EV production needed (in kWh per day) / panel efficiency (in kWh) = number of solar panels needed
Example math:
Take the example of the Hyundai Ioniq 6, the most energy efficient electric sedan on the road today:
Step 1. According to fueleconomy.gov, it averages 24 kWh/100 mi or 0.24 kWh/mi.
Step 2. We'll also use the EPA's average mileage estimate of 15,000 annual miles, which works out to around 41 miles per day.
Step 3. 0.24 kWh/mi x 41 miles = 9.86 kWh daily power EV usage
Step 4. 9.86 kWh / 4 peak sun hours = 2.4 kW (This is how much solar energy in kW you will need to charge your EV).
Step 5. We will use a solar panel wattage of 410W, such as the Q.PEAK Duo Black from Qcells, to calculate the number of panels needed for the Hyundai Ioniq 6. Convert the 410W to kilowatts by dividing by 1,000 (0.41 kW).
Step 6. EV production needed to charge the Hyundai Ioniq 6 (in kWh per day) / energy needed per Q.PEAK Qcells solar panel) = number of solar panels needed. 2.4 kW / 0.41 kW = 5.85 solar panels
In this example, six Qcells solar panels are needed to accommodate the energy needs of the Hyundai Ioniq 6 with average driving habits. Six Qcells solar panels don't accommodate the rest of the home's energy consumption.
Meanwhile, at the other extreme, dropping the Ford F-150 Lightning's 48 kWh/100 mi into the same formula yields a daily energy use of 19.68 kWh and a 4.9 kW solar requirement, doubling the Qcells solar panels needed to 12 panels.
If that's too much math, Fishman simply recommends putting around eight to 12 solar modules on a canopy that you can use as a solar carport.
"It's about 2.5 kilowatts that you need for a canopy. You might go a little more, but that's all you need," Fishman said.
We've seen others in the industry put the figure at closer to 3 kW, but if you're unsure, you can run through all the math for your situation.
How many solar panels will I need to power my whole home?
This basically comes down to figuring out your home's total energy needs and then designing a solar array that can meet those needs.
To calculate how many solar panels your home will need: Desired energy production (kW) / Solar panel wattage (kW) = Number of solar panels needed
There's a lot of things to consider to determine both sides of this equation, and CNET goes into further detail on the subject here. Adding EV chargers to your home simply means adding more energy use to both sides of the equation.
Most reputable solar companies will help you work out your energy needs and propose a solution that they will surely be willing to install for you. But doing the math on your own as well can help you make the most informed choice when it comes to picking an installer and assisting in designing a system that meets your needs best.
Don't forget that there are other things you might want to do before even beginning to consider solar for your home. Making energy efficiency improvements can go a long way toward shrinking your overall needs and thereby shrinking the size of the solar system you require.
Is it worth it to add more solar panels to accommodate an EV?
Adding more panels to your existing solar system or to one that you're planning is one way to power all your home's energy needs, including your EV. But it isn't necessarily the only way to charge your EV. You can also build a stand-alone off-grid system that's dedicated to just your car.
Fishman recommends building a carport topped with solar panels at just the right tilt to get a good amount of sun on average, based on your location on the globe.
"A carport is fixed at latitude," she explained. "So if you're at 42 degrees above the Equator, then your tilt for your solar modules is 42 degrees."
Which comes first: A solar panel or EV purchase?
If you're dedicated to renewable energy and kicking fossil fuels to the curb, it makes sense to have your solar system all setup before you spring for the EV so you never have to worry about charging your car from dirtier energy sources that mix with renewables on the grid.
But the reality for many people will be that an EV and home solar energy are two very costly investments. A car or EV tends to be a personal purchase that we spend a lot of time in, whereas energy is a readily available commodity that we tend to think about less. So it wouldn't be surprising for people to prioritize a flashy new EV over adding solar panels to a home that already has access to electricity via the grid.
Ultimately, it comes down to your priorities and your situation. Maybe your utility is good about incorporating solar into its energy mix via its own solar farm systems, renewable energy credits or offering a community solar program. If so, you might have fewer qualms with plugging in your car at night, no matter how many panels are on the roof.

Longer than I had thought but seems to give a good process to determine how many are really needed.

SpaceNut · 2024-02-19 09:03:28

The Real Reason Why Toyota Is Making Hybrids Instead Of EVs

SpaceNut · 2024-03-17 11:53:31

380.000 Sold and Counting: The 5 Best-Selling Electric Cars in the US

5. Ford Mustang Mach-E (40,771 units sold)
4. Rivian R1T/R1S (47,200 units sold)
3. Chevrolet Bolt EV/Bolt EUV (62,045 units sold)
2. Tesla Model 3 (232,700 units sold)
1. Tesla Model Y (385,900 units sold)

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#326 2023-05-03 19:27:20

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#327 2023-05-26 03:20:48

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#328 2023-06-13 22:17:11

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#329 2023-07-03 03:47:44

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#330 2023-07-03 07:01:54

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#331 2023-08-05 15:10:49

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#332 2023-08-05 16:20:57

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#333 2023-08-05 16:23:24

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#334 2023-12-01 19:31:53

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#335 2023-12-02 02:04:21

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#336 2023-12-03 07:39:18

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#337 2023-12-03 12:21:14

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#338 2023-12-04 02:03:53

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#339 2023-12-17 16:10:43

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#340 2023-12-18 09:57:41

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#341 2024-01-15 15:33:33

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#342 2024-01-20 12:16:26

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#343 2024-02-17 12:56:58

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#344 2024-02-19 09:03:28

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

#345 2024-03-17 11:53:31

Re: Fixing Americas car industry

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