New Mars Forums

Official discussion forum of The Mars Society and MarsNews.com

You are not logged in.

Announcement

Announcement: As a reader of NewMars forum, we have opportunities for you to assist with technical discussions in several initiatives underway. NewMars needs volunteers with appropriate education, skills, talent, motivation and generosity of spirit as a highly valued member. Write to newmarsmember * gmail.com to tell us about your ability's to help contribute to NewMars and become a registered member.

#526 2020-12-17 20:44:20

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Offline

#527 2020-12-18 07:18:52

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut ... two topics ...

First, glad to hear you missed the worst of the storm, but 20 inches is ** plenty ** !!!

Second ... I went to the Mars Society members forum, found you there, and wanted to send a message, but could not.

If a person wants to apply for membership in the NewMars forum, how can they do that?

(th)

Offline

#528 2020-12-18 09:35:11

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

The Mars Society member area https://members.marssociety.org/ is open to all and contains spammers not talking about Mars already and it did not require membership to join. Yes once you have that account one could email me but we want something that gets paying members first I would think.

The Mars Society staff page is https://www.marssociety.org/staff/
If I was doing accounts to NewMars Forum this would be some of the first group to get an ID to convert with instructions on how to change things. Some are already members of NewMars currently but I have only seen James post but would need to check the list for others to confirm.

There appears to be no Mars Society membership list available to draw in members.

We will get through this as we fix the forum and remove the spammer accounts.

Offline

#529 2020-12-18 09:43:54

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re #528 and topic of recruiting and admitting new members

Look what I found!

Profile Photo
Internet Task Force
Private Group


Request Membership
Viewing 1 - 9 Of 9 Groups

The Internet Group is "by invitation"

It may be possible to create a "group" like that one that would point to NewMars.

What is important (vital) is for you and those you designate to perform vetting of applicants.

Everyone currently in the NewMars membership is grandfathered in, because they have been vetted by NOT behaving like spammers.

However, NEW members can be selected to take on responsibility for advancing various projects.

If someone wants to talk about space there are a myriad of places they can go.

This forum has the opportunity to become a place where folks (especially younger ones) come to build up the knowledge and skills necessary to become Mars settlers.  That is a long term project, and fortunately, this forum has been around for at least 20 years, and perhaps as much as 25.

(th)

Offline

#530 2020-12-18 09:56:53

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

Thats once you log into the members area though

here is the page for the area
https://www.marssociety.org/members-area-update/

with the internet task force http://itf.marssociety.org/

more on the new members area https://www.marssociety.org/members-area/

Offline

#531 2020-12-18 10:21:33

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re #530

Thanks for keeping this initiative moving!

The goal here is to find a way ...  ** some ** way !!! for a person who wants to contribute to the NewMars forum to be able to so so.

It's ** easy ** if one of our existing members nominates someone .... They post a message to you (probably in this topic) and you proceed from there to decide if you want to admit the person.  I expect that most of the time a nomination by an existing member will be sufficient.

However, what is ** not ** easy, and in fact appears to be impossible, is to gain admission if the candidate does NOT already know an existing member who can nominate them.

I am working the problem of the "impossible" admission.

Thanks for your help as we (hopefully) advance toward arriving at a method that works reliably!

My concern right now is that (as an honorary member of the Mars Society) I am UNABLE to contact you to let you know that I want to nominate someone for membership in NewMars forum.

As you continue study of the situation, please keep an eye on what might be possible.

So far I've not found the solution, but for the sake of all those potential contributors to the NewMars forum who (possibly) may be "out there", let's keep looking.

Edit#1: I followed the links you provided in #530

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp … A/viewform

The document at the link above shows what a person would see if they were to be interested in joining NewMars forum, if NewMars forum were a chapter.

I was not logged into marssociety.org when that document displayed, so I presume it is available to everyone.


(th)

Last edited by tahanson43206 (2020-12-18 11:28:45)

Offline

#532 2020-12-18 12:47:02

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut .... on a completely ** different ** subject ...

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/snow-re … 00594.html

This vehicle would (should) work well in 20 inch snow!

(th)

Offline

#533 2020-12-18 17:42:37

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

I found a way to put the join Mars society link into the blue bar that contains the

Index  User list  Rules  Search  Profile  Administration  Logout

Its on the admin option page and since the webmaster did not want any changes to the appearance of the website it will need to go through James.

This would be the first step to boosting the ranks of paying members that could and might want to have access to the forum to post.

https://www.marssociety.org/join/

Membership Rates:
1 Year    3 Years
Regular    $50    $100
Student    $25    $50
Senior (65+)    $25    $50
Family    $100    $200
Lifetime    $1000    (One-time payment)

To register for membership, please click the button below.

Join Usth?id=OIP.R-lmUN8qhwIfozzv94p56AHaHr&w=97&h=106&c=8&rs=1&qlt=90&pid=3.1&rm=2

only the words are in the button on the mars society site registration page.

Offline

#534 2020-12-18 18:19:16

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut .... Thanks for the interesting ideas in Post #533

As a reminder (for those who may be following this discussion) ... the options seen by someone who is not logged in are:

Index User list Rules Search Register Login

You are not logged in.Topics: Active | Unanswered

The place to consider the new button might be in the Register page.

That way, "Register" continues to show up as it always has, and the appearance of the main page is not disturbed.

(th)

Offline

#535 2020-12-18 18:43:54

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

The spammers would flood back in if we reactivate that feature....we need something that forces new registering to pay for that option to be valid....which means code rewrite and placement by the webmaster…..

Offline

#536 2020-12-18 20:14:33

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut .... we've allowed ourselves to become distracted from the problem at hand ...

How can a person who joins the Mars Society contact you?

I reported an attempt to do that, and I reported that I could see no way to contact you while logged in as a Mars Society member.

Let's not worry about the button right now. 

How can a person who is ** already ** subscribed to the Mars Society contact you?

I did not see an email function, or anything like it?

If you know the answer, please let me know what it is so I can try it!

(th)

Offline

#537 2020-12-18 20:22:05

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

I have been spammed by the new members area on the Mars society page so it happens but it does not list me on that pages as being an admin for NewMars for or does it imply that I am a registration clearing house. In fact the old means did not have any sort of clearing or vetting function to it....
We need to make it hurt to those that would abuse the registration function for the would be spammers so as to keep them away no matter what direction we can or do go...
We want Mars Society to gain in the long run not just the forum as they are paying for the forums existence....

logging into the https://members.marssociety.org/members/ you will see whom the members are and can email from that point. There are already Members 1,844.... But to get NewMars a better siting on the Mars societies home page or at the forum link of Mars society for Newmars seem to be where we would want an email interface for contacting for an account to be vetted...

edit
Initially that area was opened with no membership requirement and I do not know if its still that way or not...

Last edited by SpaceNut (2020-12-18 20:55:45)

Offline

#538 2020-12-18 20:34:22

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For spaceNut .... Thanks for continuing to try to explain the situation at the Mars Society ...

I don't understand how spam is possible if payment of membership is required.

No membership should be awarded unless the applicant has paid the membership fee.

By paying a membership fee, the application proves they have a valid credit card, have a "real" name, and have real identification information, including address, telephone number and perhaps other information the Mars Society might require.

How could spam occur in that environment?

(th)

Offline

#539 2020-12-18 20:50:25

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re ID's recovery ....

One of the benefits of this review is finding members who contributed long ago ...

That is the case with this member.  I only wish this member had stayed engaged, but perhaps the great crash interfered:

akinkhoo - Essentials
User activity
Registered: 2008-02-28 (0.0.0.0)

Last post: 2008-02-29 12:57:29

Last visit: 2008-02-28 14:31:39

Posts: 5 - Show all topics - Show all posts - Show all subscriptions

The posts include text indicating the author is of Chinese background. I was pleased to see an analysis of the history of the Nation.  The analysis contains elements that are similar to my understanding from readings over the years.

(th)

Offline

#540 2020-12-18 20:59:20

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

akinkhoo, would definitely be a member to reach out to as to again verify desire to be on the forum as well as to make sure they can still get in...

from the unclosed accounts we just got a spammer...
up next to the line which indicates you are logged in you will see the "there are new reports" link to view what I just banned and deleted....

Offline

#541 2020-12-18 21:09:17

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re #540 and Akinkhoo ... thank you for the appropriate reminder that a member from so long ago may not be able to access the account.  For one thing, years have passed so the password is surely long gone from memory, or even paper records. For another, the database itself might not be holding the password in currently decryptable form.  I needed to be reminded.

Here is another member from long ago ...

akkakappa - Essentials
User activity
Registered: 2007-10-24 (0.0.0.0)

Last post: 2007-10-27 08:35:52

Last visit: 2007-11-14 06:12:21

Posts: 3 - Show all topics - Show all posts - Show all subscriptions

This person was (briefly) interested in bombarding the Moon to make an atmosphere. In a later post he seemed to understand that any molecules liberated to gaseous form are unlikely to remain around more than one Lunar day.

Edit: SpaceNut ... this one is a puzzle ... akwx128 - Essentials

The ID is in banned status, but the person contributed 13 posts before doing something to get banned.  An early post indicates the person was a student at the time, with an interest in space.

You may not have been the Administrator at the time.  What do you want to do with this particular ID?

Edit#2: ID's 723-744 are ready for unbanning.

I added comments to several ID's that need additional review.

Closing down for this evening.  Hope everyone has a good weekend.

(th)

Last edited by tahanson43206 (2020-12-18 21:54:48)

Offline

#542 2020-12-18 22:16:09

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut ...

This post is about a (to me surprising but it should not have been) offering in the Mars Society web site: marssociety.org

Other Member Benefits
Benefits of Membership to the Mars Society include a membership card, a special invitation and discount to the International Mars Society Convention, regular Mars Society email updates and announcements, and discounts at our official Online Store.

Sign up for the Mars Society Newsletter.

Register for the International Mars Society Convention and receive a discounted members-only rate.

Participate in the New Mars Discussion Forums.

Purchase items from Shop@Mars – our official online store.  Use discount code MARTIAN for a members-only discount.

NEWS

Were you aware that if a person clicks on the "Participate" link, the NewMars forum pops up?

The page that appears is the standard login page for the NewMars forum.

I'm assuming a person who has logged into the Mars Society web site does NOT automatically have access to the NewMars forum.

Can you confirm that?

To test my hypothesis, we need the assistance of a Mars Society member who is not already a NewMars member.

(th)

Offline

#543 2020-12-19 09:39:46

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut ... this post will be for ID recovery for 745-770

Edit#1:

AlanaGuill - Essentials
Registered: 2019-05-18 (185.68.145.91)
Last post: Never
Last visit: 2019-05-18 23:08:05
Posts: 0 - Show all topics - Show all posts - Show all subscriptions
Admin note: IP address is Russia - Please consider for recovery

Edit#2: I just noticed your attention to OXQEldon65.  It was interesting to see how bold he was/is.

(th)

Last edited by tahanson43206 (2020-12-19 10:32:22)

Offline

#544 2020-12-19 10:43:58

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

Duplicate found in id's 727 -750 for unban performed on

TestID00748 alannaasher28@price.opbeingop.com 107.175.109.146 Never   SpaceNut Edit | Remove
TestID00748 alannaasher28@price.opbeingop.com   Never   SpaceNut Edit | Remove

Still working communicational issue as I did sign in for the task force.

You may have also seen the friend request on the member site as well.

edit
No activity on akwx128 which was at the period of crash years so I have added that not for the ban and this is a member to reach out to again to see how  to get them involved once more.

AlanaGuill looks like a spammer account and when you look at the duplicate username above in this post seem like they like the name Alan* which makes sense as I have seen this before being done...

edit 2
testid 00748 has been deleted and a new id was used to make a new one for the sequence.

will continue on the remaining above 750 for unbanning

found another duplicate in the banned

TestID00759 albertaasher100@bill.felphi.com 209.251.23.98 Never   SpaceNut Edit | Remove
TestID00759 albertaasher100@bill.felphi.com   Never   SpaceNut Edit | Remove

will make another for it and that will bring my unbanning to 760 at that point

Offline

#545 2020-12-19 11:36:37

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re #544

Thanks for your hard work on this ... my apology if something I am doing is causing the duplicates!

Thanks for updates on communication via friend request ... I'll go over there to see if I can learn what that is.

Here is a member coming up in the flow ....

Here is a brief visitor from 2005.  The text suggests a student working on space related topics.

It is 15 years later ... with any luck, this person may be in the main part of a career in technology.

Probably worth a follow up email.

Interplanetary transportation » VASIMR for LEO Launches? - What prevents it? » 2005-01-31 16:03:06

Alcon

[c o l or=#000000:post_uid0]Well, theoretically, with enough power, one could do both: heat a very large amount of propellant to a very high tempurature.  But its just not within range of the VASIMR I guess.  There's a good reason for my not seeming to think terribly clearly as of last night: a 16 page paper on space launch, that I'd spent about 19 hours working on under the influence of about 6 cans of Dr. Pepper and a couple of cups of tea.
Thanks to everyone who responded. [/color:post_uid0]

Interplanetary transportation » VASIMR for LEO Launches? - What prevents it? » 2005-01-31 03:30:54

Alcon

[c o l or=#000000:post_uid0]Yeah... that makes sense, should have caught that, but my brain isn't operating on full function this late at night.  Ok next question: why do thrust and specific impulse seem to be inverses?  Why do engines like the VASIMR and ion drives that have such huge specific impulses have small thrusts.  The equations I have in front of me in Zubrin'ss [i:post_uid0]Entering Space[/i:post_uid0]  seem to indicated that a high Isp would lead to a high trust.  C = [i:post_uid0]g[/i:post_uid0](Isp) and T = [i:post_uid0]m[/i:post_uid0]C where T  is thrust, m is the propellant mass flow, c is the exhaust velocity and g is the acceleration due to gravity.  Is there an equation relating propellant mass flow to Isp?  I've read that they aren't always inverses just in the case of the VASIMR.  Why is that the case?[/color:post_uid0]

Interplanetary transportation » VASIMR for LEO Launches? - What prevents it? » 2005-01-31 02:10:59

Alcon

[c o l or=#000000:post_uid9]Why isn't any one talking about using the VASIMR for Earth to LEO launches?  Reports on it I've seen claim that it can reach either very high Isp or very high trusts, so why wouldn't it work well for sending ships to LEO?[/color:post_uid9]

***
Today's batch is ready for unbanning .... 745-770 (hoping no duplicates)

(th)

Last edited by tahanson43206 (2020-12-19 11:44:36)

Offline

#546 2020-12-19 14:01:36

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re granting access to NewMars from Mars Society

Here is a possibility ...

Join a Chapter – if you are not already a member of a local Chapter in your area, please access this link to find out if one exists.  If not, we invite you to create one by contacting our Chapters team.

If you decide you are interested in this, the chapter would be International ...

If this forum becomes an official Chapter, then when a Mars Society member clicks on the Join a Chapter link, this forum would be one of the choices.

I don't have any experience pursuing this, but since my region has a chapter I could follow the link there to see what happens.

What I'd like to avoid is having to deal with third party entities like Facebook ....

Edit#1: I used the Contact (via email) link in marssociety.org/members ... I'll let you know if I hear anything.

(th)

Last edited by tahanson43206 (2020-12-19 14:16:47)

Offline

#547 2020-12-19 15:18:28

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

post 545 quote shows how the corruption from converting from one forum software to another has caused.

will read the chapter stuff to see if its got a paid to create or to be a member but last I remembered these did not.
..

Forming a Chapter
Chapters of the Mars Society are local, independent groups which are organized by members. 
There are Mars Society chapters in many U.S. states, and countries around the world. 
These groups typically work on Mars-related projects together.

So have web site to keeptrack of meetings, minutes ect

now to finishing the unbanning of the remaining accounts that have been converted...

id's 761 - 770 complete

Offline

#548 2020-12-20 07:49:13

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut ... this post is intended to provide an anchor for today's ID recovery work session (771-792)

To lead off, I'm inspired by your new topic about internal combustion engines on Mars to think about My Hacienda.  Shortly I'll take a look at the entries there, to see if we have created a category for manufacture of CO/O for indigenous vehicles and fixed location applications.

It seems to me likely that the development of a human work force to create and then sustain an infrastructure based upon this (relatively simple) chemical process would be less difficult than any competing technology.   The picture you provided at the opening of your new IC topic of two students in a vocational training facility is what inspires my thinking this morning (on Earth at my longitude).  It is all well and good for citizens of Earth who live in an advanced technical culture to talk about creating duplicates of technologies that exist on Earth.  I am skeptical that most technologies that exist on Earth today can be imported and sustained at Mars over 100 years. 

A simple CO/O industrial base would be plenty difficult to create and sustain, but there ** are ** supplies of solar energy to power the industry, there is plenty of CO2 to work with, and there ** are ** various kinds of atoms available on Mars.  Some will be easier to work with than others.  The CO/O industry, if it succeeds at all, will succeed because the material ingredients are present, and the humans involved will have the intelligence and persistence to bring it into being and to sustain it over many decades.

(th)

Offline

#549 2020-12-20 10:28:46

SpaceNut
Administrator
From: New Hampshire
Registered: 2004-07-22
Posts: 26,753

Re: Housekeeping

maintenance of a vehicle these days for most mean filling it with gas and waiting until it breaks to bring it to a garage...

Unless we have paents that can teach the skills of checking the oil at each full tank fill up they will eventually have a seazed engine from low oil or dirty oil as they did not change the filter after 3 - 5 thousand miles.
They will not know to look at the overflow coolant resevoir to see if its low before the car over heats.
Checking the break resevoir so as to make sure the fluid is not low as to prevent slidng into another vehicle when breaking.
Or checking the transmission fluid when its warm and running to see if its low so as to keep the can from burning its bands.
Look at the tires for being soft and worn before you have a blow out due to wear through and looking for cupping for alignment issues.

Some vehicles need more maintenance than others and if its not garaged its bound to break down sooner from the weather elelments.

Offline

#550 2020-12-20 11:06:26

tahanson43206
Moderator
Registered: 2018-04-27
Posts: 12,008

Re: Housekeeping

For SpaceNut re #549

That post, short as it is compared to ones by kbd512, deserves it's own memory tag:

http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php … 06#p175106

SearchTerm:Maintenance Automobile on Earth extrapolating to Mars

Your post brings up the issue of lubricant needed for machinery on Mars.

We (humans) take for granted the largess provided by Nature, of lubricants stored for us over eons.  We are busy using up the stores, but in the mean time, enterprising researchers have been trying to work out how to create hydrocarbon chains suitable for manufacture of lubricants.

Hopefully the knowledge of how to make lubricants from CO2 and water on Mars will be available when it is needed.

The internal combustion engine concept you've introduced as a separate topic recently is a massive consumer of high grade lubricants, none of which exist on Mars right now (to the best of my knowledge).  There may (indeed, must) be some in the vehicles placed by humans on Mars, but those don't count!

A category of specialization for My Hacienda is manufacture of lubricants, if it does not already exist in the list of specializations there.

Edit#1: Knowing you're busy with numerous other responsibilities, I regret adding this to your list...

akwx128 - Essentials is "banned" but the ID has 13 posts, most of which seem to be reasonable. My issue is that the word "banned" is what I am looking for when I work on ID's to recover, and that one is now a big fat target when I open a session. 

Here is a possible solution ... mark it as "member" but change the password.

That way whatever caused the original banning will not repeat, but the posts will be visible.

Edit#1: Here is a member from 2006 who arrived with what appear to be education and experience ...

aldiffer - Essentials
User activity
Registered: 2006-05-12 (0.0.0.0)
Last post: 2006-06-29 03:00:02
Last visit: 2006-07-26 01:59:34
Posts: 18 - Show all topics - Show all posts - Show all subscriptions

This was the first of a set of (to me for sure) interesting posts.

This contributor appears to have been ahead of Void with his "bubble landing on Mars" topic.

That's about what I thought they would say.  They got a nice opportunity to look at a competing vehicle and declare it unworthy.  It would have flown, though.  There is nothing surprising in that old news.
I am now the CTO at General Orbital.  I've carried my interests in inflatables over to our new company where we are putting our own stamp on things.  We are a little busy trying to raise cash right now, so I haven't kept up with what people are saying.  I'll try to check in occasionally, though.

Edit#2: Here's another member ... this one is from 2005 ...

aldo12xu - Essentials
User activity
Registered: 2005-04-04 (0.0.0.0)
Last post: 2005-10-24 16:47:51
Last visit: 2005-10-04 13:36:13
Posts: 31 - Show all topics - Show all posts - Show all subscriptions

This member from 2005 appears to have been doing some serious work with photographs of Mars ...

: Unmanned probes » Anatolia trough & Mars karst topography » 2005-04-04 14:20:09

[c o l o r=#000000:post_uid0]I don't know if anyone has discussed this paper discussing a karst-like origin for the Anatolia trough/crack seen by Opportunity on sols 70-81:
ftp://www.lpi.usra.edu/pub/outgoing/lpsc2005/full77.pdf
Sz. Berczi (2005), Lunar and Planetary Science XXXVI. Possibility of Karst Morphology on the Martian Surface at the Merdidiani Landing Site from Comparison with Terrestrial Analogs.
I added some of my own observations and a write up on my site http://www.marsgeo.com/
So check it out and feel free to make any comments.
Cheers,
Aldo.[/c o l o r:post_uid0]

Edit at 19:57 local time ... ID's 771-792 are ready for unbanning

Please note that TestID00781 and TestID00792 could use a count reset.

(th)

Last edited by tahanson43206 (2020-12-20 18:58:44)

Offline

Board footer

Powered by FluxBB