God the know it all;

Michael Bloxham · 2005-04-04 20:40:18

Could you elaborate, dicktice?

dicktice · 2005-04-05 07:39:15

Sure thing. For an "entity" to be cognizant or in control or whatever, of The Universe, it would seem essential that an awareness be maintained of all aspects of said Universe. But unless this awareness/cognizance/control/whatever is able to propagate at greater than light-speed....

Dook · 2005-04-05 08:16:07

When you start your computer do you have to type in all the 1's and 0's to give it the binary code that tells it what to do?

God set the parameters. He chose the physics that would enable life to evolve in the universe. Then He started it all with a bang. Now He is sitting back and watching it all happen.

The process that formed life on the earth is no different than the processes in neighboring solar systems. A planet in a life zone, water, and DNA.

clark · 2005-04-05 08:34:53

Then wouldn't that make the Universe a giant Screen-saver, Dook? :laugh:

dicktice · 2005-04-05 10:23:59

You'd better define what you mean by "watching," Electromagnetic radiation's rate of propagation, by means of which we see the Universe, being constant at least for us mortals, doesn't allow simultaneous watching over everything. I hope you are't going to invoke supernatural seeing attributes, because that'd be the parting of the ways as far as I'm concerned.

Ian Flint · 2005-04-05 11:00:15

Michael Bloxham
Dook, what makes you think life is plentiful throughout the universe? The odds of a single occurance are infinite to one...

Michael, why do you think the odds are infinite to one?

The chance of life is infinite-to-one, I once heard.

Oh yeah...you once heard... ???

Ya know, I once heard that I was God. It went something like this...
I walked into a room, and an old friend, surprised to see me, exclaimed, "Oh God, it's Ian!"

...

No one knows how plentiful life is in the universe. No one knows the odds of life evolving. It is all guess work and conjecture. We only have evidence of life on one planet. Until we prove or disprove that life exists elswhere, this conversation is pointless.

Cobra Commander · 2005-04-05 11:24:41

i'll get back to this after I finally get around to answering CobraCommanders 'Rare Earth' stuff . . . .

Take as much time as you need.

Oh yeah...you once heard...
Ya know, I once heard that I was God. It went something like this...

:laugh: Sorry, I thought this was going somewhere else.

No one knows how plentiful life is in the universe. No one knows the odds of life evolving. It is all guess work and conjecture. We only have evidence of life on one planet. Until we prove or disprove that life exists elswhere, this conversation is pointless.

Exactly. One sample does not a pattern make.

Dook · 2005-04-05 11:41:28

You'd better define what you mean by "watching"

You think we are so smart, like a Star Trek episode our technology is always the best.

Think of a book that holds all the knowledge of the universe then think of another book that is just as large but only the first few pages are filled in, the rest of the pages are blank. We are the second book. Even in our wildest imaginations we haven't even scratched the surface.

By 'watching' I meant that God started and watched the big bang. How much God can see is beyond me.

clark · 2005-04-05 11:56:11

Oh, oh, pick me Ian! [raise hand and shakes furiously]

I know the answer to this one!

No one knows how plentiful life is in the universe.

Almost 7 billion humans, give or take, and a lot of "lower" life forms (unless you are from PETA, then they are higher, and we should do them all a favor and start culling our herd)

No one knows the odds of life evolving.

100 hundred percent! All known life evolved!

We only have evidence of life on one planet.

There are some flags waving on the Moon, and some artifical machines on Mars, and Venus- does that count as evidence?!

Since I know all this, does that make me God? Would God even have to ask? Maybe we were created by God so It could ask us if It was God.

Exsistence does not prove or disprove the concept of God, it merely allows for the question to be posed. And as far as questions go, the answer does little to improve our lot.

Cobra Commander · 2005-04-05 11:57:21

By 'watching' I meant that God started and watched the big bang. How much God can see is beyond me.

If he can't see everything he isn't omnitient, which perhaps calls into question his "godness", depending on how one defines "God".

But somehow I like the idea that God created a huge friggin' explosion just for the hell of it then got bored with the aftermath.

clark · 2005-04-05 12:01:15

But somehow I like the idea that God created a huge friggin' explosion just for the hell of it then got bored with the aftermath.

God as a ten year old boy?

Dook · 2005-04-05 12:22:10

By 'watching' I meant that God started and watched the big bang. How much God can see is beyond me.
If he can't see everything he isn't omnitient, which perhaps calls into question his "godness", depending on how one defines "God".
But somehow I like the idea that God created a huge friggin' explosion just for the hell of it then got bored with the aftermath.

I never said God was omnipotent, the church did.

Would you follow them and fill their coffers with money if God was only capable of simple magic tricks?

I don't really think God got bored with it all. I believe there is some benefit, matter becomes sentient and when it dies good souls return energy to Him or something.

Trebuchet · 2005-04-05 12:22:49

But somehow I like the idea that God created a huge friggin' explosion just for the hell of it then got bored with the aftermath.

A portion of the holy Book of Vlork much studied by the clerics of the faith, no doubt. :laugh:

The arguments for God obeying the rules of his own universe seem to me like listening to 'The Sims' argue about the abilities the player playing the game might have. The universe might very well be "God's screensaver", or at least his version of the Sims, for all we know. It's thus sort of a stupid question to get excited about.

As for the truth of various religions, it's untrue that they cannot be falsified. You can, in fact, verify various religions: First, jump off the roof of a very tall building.

1) IF you merely cease to exist, the atheists were correct.
2) If you find yourself being judged and sent to heaven or hell, either the Christians, Jews, or Muslims were correct, and further questioning of those who share your fate will reveal which of the above was correct.
3) If you find yourself in hell, then suddenly in heaven because a descendant converted you posthumously, the Mormons were correct.
4) IF you find yourself back on earth, the Hindus or some other reincarnated sect was correct. Attempt to verify what determines who/what you were reincarnated as, as this may assist in determining the correct belief structure of the universe.
5) I'm thinking that the Bhuddists were into reincarnation, too, but if you suddenly find yourself in Nirvana, I guess that settles things.

Of course, the results of the experiment can't be proven to others, but being True Men of Science it doesn't matter what the rest of the world merely believes, so long as we have proof in our hands! Right? Right.

clark · 2005-04-05 12:25:27

If one jumps, and survives, does that make you god?

Trebuchet · 2005-04-05 12:27:14

I don't really think God got bored with it all. I believe there is some benefit, matter becomes sentient and when it dies good souls return energy to Him or something.

The benefit is probably entertainment, which certainly explains why we would be given free will. It allows us to act in defiance of all logic and sanity, thus increasing our entertainment value. And with some 7 billion of us, many heavily armed and/or nuts, you can be assured that God may have many qualities, but 'bored' is not one of them.

Trebuchet · 2005-04-05 12:28:19

If one jumps, and survives, does that make you god?

It means you need a bigger building. ^_^

clark · 2005-04-05 12:31:56

So could god make a building so tall that if he jumped from it, he would die?

Where does god go when he dies?

The benefit is probably entertainment, which certainly explains why we would be given free will. It allows us to act in defiance of all logic and sanity, thus increasing our entertainment value. And with some 7 billion of us, many heavily armed and/or nuts, you can be assured that God may have many qualities, but 'bored' is not one of them.

Can you imagine his remote? Man, he must be still surfing the Crusade season, episode 3 was a classic.

Trebuchet · 2005-04-05 12:36:12

Where does god go when he dies?

Back to heaven, aren't you up on that whole 'Jesus' incident?

clark · 2005-04-05 12:37:31

Before my time, man.

Palomar · 2005-04-05 12:39:33

I don't really think God got bored with it all. I believe there is some benefit, matter becomes sentient and when it dies good souls return energy to Him or something.

*I've entertained thoughts along this line as well.

There's a Native American (Toltec??) belief that all energy is ultimately reabsorbed by "The Eagle."

Perhaps we're all extensions of "The Eagle" which learn, experience, grow, discern...then when we die, our attainments, knowledge, experience, etc., are absorbed into an ever-growing and ever-learning Entity.

::shrugs::

Yeah, that raises more questions...

--Cindy

clark · 2005-04-05 12:40:35

Or maybe we are all bird droppings. Present company excluded, of course.

Ian Flint · 2005-04-05 15:18:33

You may be that little white speck on top of the chicken poop, but you're still chicken poop.

--- paraphrased from that George Strait movie (can't remember the name).

Michael Bloxham · 2005-04-05 15:58:17

You know what the truth is? Creation? Evolution? Truth is we just don't know. Nothing makes any sense. It just is.

Dook · 2005-04-05 16:46:57

Perhaps we're all extensions of "The Eagle" which learn, experience, grow, discern...then when we die, our attainments, knowledge, experience, etc., are absorbed into an ever-growing and ever-learning Entity.

Good energy (souls) return to God, replenish the source, making what was good even better.

That would explain why there is a hell, if there is. I've always had a hard time believing in hell, much more than believing in God. Why would God abandon immortal energy? But if that energy formed from matter and decided, chose to be bad then God certainly wouldn't want it.

So if that is true then there is a real battle going on in the universe. Good vs evil. I wonder what happens if God loses?

clark · 2005-04-06 05:40:45

Oh, I know this one...

Good energy (souls) return to God, replenish the source, making what was good even better.
That would explain why there is a hell, if there is. I've always had a hard time believing in hell, much more than believing in God. Why would God abandon immortal energy? But if that energy formed from matter and decided, chose to be bad then God certainly wouldn't want it.
So if that is true then there is a real battle going on in the universe. Good vs evil. I wonder what happens if God loses?

If there is a God, and it sends people to hell, or heaven, why does it allow innocent children to suffer so a few souls can be saved?

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