Empire vs Rebel Alliance

Palomar · 2005-06-15 12:18:30

*I'm still wondering what happened to Darth Maul. They should have kept him...to heck with General Grievous.
But then I never liked that double-bladed lightsaber of Maul's, though adapting it to staff techniques was interesting.
Just thinking about the training accidents that must happen with such a thing, I wouldn't touch it. ???

?

Oh...I just recalled what you're referring to. Nasty.

I wouldn't come within a mile of any sort of lightsaber, if they were for real...(but then I've never been overly fond of weapons anyway...)

--Cindy

P.S.: What I wish Lucas would have done was devoted only half of Episode I to Anakin as a child, and then skip forward to him in his late teens. Devote Episode II to a gradual building up of his seduction to the Dark Side and then really unleash (though slowly and believably) his turn to the DS in Episode III. Cut out the peripheral characters, the fancy-shmancy starship fights, etc. Oh well.

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-15 12:39:05

I wouldn't come within a mile of any sort of lightsaber, if they were for real...(but then I've never been overly fond of weapons anyway...)

It seems to me that a lightsaber, like a sword, could be very useful in cultivating grace and coordination of form and movement even if you never intend to skewer anyone with it.

Not that you need that, of course.

But then having smacked myself in the back of the head with a jo-staff once, I'd stay away from that double-bladed thing. :laugh:

P.S.: What I wish Lucas would have done was devoted only half of Episode I to Anakin as a child, and then skip forward to him in his late teens.

Or skip the whole kid thing entirely. It would be more consistent with the OT ("when I first met your father he was already an accomplished pilot", etc) but would also have gotten past what was essentially a waste of time. If the kid had done something evil during the race or something, that might have served a purpose. As it was. . . but what do I know, George Lucas has been more succesful making movies than I'll ever be. <shrug>

On the other hand, no one ever accused Lucas of being a great writer. :;):

And while we're rewriting someone else's story, I might have preferred making Palpatine a more tragic character. Sure, patient evil mastermind is okay but somehow I'd have preferred him starting as a good and sincere figure who is over time corrupted by politics and war, ultimately becoming the Emperor truly believing he's doing what's right.

Palomar · 2005-06-15 13:32:47

I wouldn't come within a mile of any sort of lightsaber, if they were for real...(but then I've never been overly fond of weapons anyway...)
It seems to me that a lightsaber, like a sword, could be very useful in cultivating grace and coordination of form and movement even if you never intend to skewer anyone with it.
Not that you need that, of course.
But then having smacked myself in the back of the head with a jo-staff once, I'd stay away from that double-bladed thing. :laugh:
P.S.: What I wish Lucas would have done was devoted only half of Episode I to Anakin as a child, and then skip forward to him in his late teens.
Or skip the whole kid thing entirely. It would be more consistent with the OT ("when I first met your father he was already an accomplished pilot", etc) but would also have gotten past what was essentially a waste of time. If the kid had done something evil during the race or something, that might have served a purpose. As it was. . . but what do I know, George Lucas has been more succesful making movies than I'll ever be. <shrug>
On the other hand, no one ever accused Lucas of being a great writer. :;):
And while we're rewriting someone else's story, I might have preferred making Palpatine a more tragic character. Sure, patient evil mastermind is okay but somehow I'd have preferred him starting as a good and sincere figure who is over time corrupted by politics and war, ultimately becoming the Emperor truly believing he's doing what's right.

*The lightsaber really was a brilliant idea. I recall seeing grown men having "duels" in the aisles of toy stores after the first film's release. For a 12-year-old to see 30-somethings doing that...(especially back then)... :laugh:

The old laser guns/pistols were already tired by that point; all the cheesy B-rated movies and etc. The lightsaber was unique.

Speaking of the Emperor, I noticed that after he dropped the Palpatine persona, his eyes always have that Sith glow. Anakin's does intermittently; his eyes glowed immediately after becoming a Sith, but were normal when Padme went to confront him. Seems he can will them to be normal or Sith.

--Cindy

P.S.: Remembered what I was going to say: Well, I don't know much about weapons, but that double-bladed lightsaber of Darth Maul's seems too farfetched.

Palomar · 2005-06-16 06:45:45

*Just one more "how I'd re-write the story" post.

While Palpatine was working on Anakin, someone within the Sith (at Palpatine's request of course) could have made it look like the Jedi -- or someone very sympathetic to them -- killed Padme. The children have been born prior to their mother's tragic and strange death, Anakin begins bonding with them, then suddenly they are whisked away. Anakin suspects a traitor within the Jedi; the remainder discount the notion. Confused, suspicious and angry -- all combined, ultimately trips him over to the Dark Side.

Maybe Anakin is accused of killing Padme. Another attempt to drive him to despair and revenge, which works.

It's very difficult to believe, IMO, that -- according to Lucas' storyline -- Anakin would have believed he could hide his newfound Sith affiliation from Padme for long, much less indefinitely. Or that she'd turn a blind eye, maybe even go along with it for the sake of keeping family together. Unless he intended to completely dominate, subject and control her. Her reaction was in keeping with her values, principles, etc. How could he have expected otherwise?

I suppose that's enough said. :-\

--Cindy

Fledi · 2005-06-16 13:16:02

Yes, something like that would have been a better storyline. I wonder that George Lucas apparently bothered so little with making the story believeable. Still, the swordfights were kind of cool.

Palomar · 2005-06-16 13:29:48

Yes, something like that would have been a better storyline. I wonder that George Lucas apparently bothered so little with making the story believeable. Still, the swordfights were kind of cool.

*Frankly, I'm amazed he passed that opportunity up. Considering Anakin flipped out a few years prior and slaughtered a bunch of Sand People (?) because of his mother...

It would have been the perfect tie-in. Palpatine slowly reeling Anakin in. Nursing babies torn from their mother's bosom and mercilessly killed, the babies abducted. Implicate the Jedi OR their sympathizers somehow...

That would have been more than enough to put Anakin firmly into the Sith camp. He was already becoming disillusioned with the Jedi anyway.

And besides, it would have made a good "whodunnit" for the audience (the identity of Padme's killer and the abductor of the babies).

It would also have made Padme an even more tragic figure (instead of dying after childbirth simply because she'd lost the will to live).

--Cindy

Palomar · 2005-06-17 11:51:01

But then I never liked that double-bladed lightsaber of Maul's, though adapting it to staff techniques was interesting.
Just thinking about the training accidents that must happen with such a thing, I wouldn't touch it.
...
It seems to me that a lightsaber, like a sword, could be very useful in cultivating grace and coordination of form and movement even if you never intend to skewer anyone with it.
Not that you need that, of course.
But then having smacked myself in the back of the head with a jo-staff once, I'd stay away from that double-bladed thing.

*If you don't mind my asking, what sort of martial arts training have you had?

This thread has probably run its course, so won't create a new one for it. Besides, might generate a bit more conversation about certain SW scenes.

--Cindy

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-17 12:31:29

*If you don't mind my asking, what sort of martial arts training have you had?

Enough to know I have a long way to go before proficiency, but enough that poorly staged fights in film annoy me to no end.

Mostly aikido, with some iaido/iajutsu thrown in, which oddly enough I'm better at. Unfortunately I was never really able to train regularly due to other commitments and frequent relocation and so have been instructed briefly under numerous sensei but worked closely with none. A little bit of training in European sword techniques (mostly broadsword, a little rapier) as well.

Consequently it's up for debate whether my lack of ranking is the result of weak skills or never having formally tested. I'm inclined toward the former, but it's always worked when required so I can't be that bad. :laugh:

At the moment I practice whenever I find the time, but haven't done so in a formal environment for a few months now for several reasons.

But the old katana draw-and-slice to a watermelon is always a big hit at barbecues.

Whatever the case, it certainly has its benefits and is worth trying for anyone with a glimmer of interest. Martial arts in general, not assaulting fruits with edged weapons, of which I'm sure certain sensei would not approve.

clark · 2005-06-20 12:04:38

My old sensei was shot and killed while moonlighting as a security guard at an apartment complex.

I was never very good with the weapons. But I did enjoy breaking bricks. That was always cool (especially stacking up several and seeing how many you can break through).

Bricks beware! The rest of you though, you're safe.

Fledi · 2005-06-20 12:12:00

We had two wooden plates with holes linked together by small plastic sticks for that.
But now the supplier of the sticks has closed business, so we are looking for other options. I'm more in favour of fully reusable options instead of expendable bricks, although it depends on the frequency of tests which is more cost effective on the long run.

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-20 12:20:33

I'm more in favour of fully reusable options instead of expendable bricks, although it depends on the frequency of tests which is more cost effective on the long run.

If it's fully reusable is it really an effective testing method when the technique involves breaking it?

But then most of my training has centered around redirecting an opponent's force and subduing them without serious injury rather than breaking things. Seems a little out of character, thinking on it.

Well, except for the sword stuff of course. :;):

clark · 2005-06-20 12:42:04

Funny story.

I was getting ready for my class when two younger children came up to me. One of them asked me to hold onto one leg at the ankle. He wanted to show his friend some trick where he would do a somersault and kick me in the face with his free leg. This was of course during the height of Teengae Mutant Ninja Turtles.

I of course happily obliged. I stood there, holding the leg as instructed.

The kid sprungup with his other leg, then fell promptly back, hitting the back of his head on the dojo floor. He cried for a while, I laughed for a while.

Then there was the time I sparred with a second degree black belt, I was like 3rd ranked in belt terms at the time (very very lowly newbie, but one of the better sparring students). No head pads were used becaause black belts are supposed to be in control.

Well, the black belt went for a full cresecent kick and I moved forward into it- got laid out in the classic head-leanding-body-shall-follow-twirl. Took me a few minutes before the world stopped spinning. :laugh:

Also gained a healthy appreciation for the speed of boxers punches during sparring matches.

So I guess the moral of the stories... people are pretty much fully reusable. But you still shouldn't break them.

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-20 13:07:09

Well, the black belt went for a full cresecent kick and I moved forward into it- got laid out in the classic head-leanding-body-shall-follow-twirl. Took me a few minutes before the world stopped spinning.

:laugh:
And I'm not just laughing about clark getting kicked in the head.

It just wouldn't be complete without a few unexpected impacts.

I don't know how much this applies to other arts, but in my experience the newbies make better sparring partners in alot of ways for aikido. Unlike those with more training, they attack with moves that you'd encounter in a real situation on the street. It can be a little disconcerting if you're used to sparring with higher ranked partners, a little reminder not to get too stuck in perfect technique.

Of course if you get carried away and try to throw one you can hurt 'em pretty bad. ???

Is it just me, or does a room full of people in white outfits slashing at invisible targets with wooden swords look kinda silly?

Sensei wearing those hakama pants doesn't help either.

clark · 2005-06-20 13:10:37

And I'm not just laughing about clark getting kicked in the head.
It just wouldn't be complete without a few unexpected impacts.

You know how many cups were broken as I sparred? too many. It was the girls you had to watch out for. I don't know, must be related to the chromosones, but they were lethal with the kicks.

Those impacts were enough to lift grown men off their feet. :laugh:

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-20 13:30:54

You know how many cups were broken as I sparred? too many. It was the girls you had to watch out for.

I hear you. :laugh:

Some of them seemed to really enjoy knocking a dude over and pinning him down. "Okay, I can't move. You can stop twisiting my wrist now" as the fingers turn blue and a muffled popping sound is heard.

Incidentally, aikido practice while on painkillers is an interesting experience. You suddenly become this weird ninja gumby, immune to pins and pain-compliance holds. Until they start doing them really hard. :laugh:

clark · 2005-06-20 13:37:13

"Okay, I can't move. You can stop twisiting my wrist now" as the fingers turn blue and a muffled popping sound is heard.

Ah yes, wrist lock with the thumb on the back hand, hand at a 90 degree angle to the wrist, and wrist held above the elbow. You ain't going nowhere. :laugh:

They ever teach you the telephone book trick?

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-20 13:45:23

They ever teach you the telephone book trick?

I don't believe so, doesn't sound familiar.

clark · 2005-06-20 14:07:53

Well, it’s more of a demonstration kind of trick to show the relative power of focused close strikes to a center of mass.

Someone stands with a telephone book against their chest, this person is affectionately called the ‘target’. The other person stands about half an arms length away or so (the person striking the target). They point their hand with fingers together (thumb on top) in a vertical position, touching the telephone book.

Then, with a flick of the wrist and a forward motion, the person strikes the target with the flat end of their palm, focusing on a point about a foot through the target. The telephone book is held to prevent any lasting damage, and one invariably is moved back from the force of the strike, even with the telephone book.

I took American Kempo.

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-21 05:36:26

I took American Kempo.

Not too familiar with it. I knew a guy that taught it, ex-Marine, but never had the time to try it.

I see what you mean with the telophone book. That might have been useful in the places I trained, we frequently had the problem of newer people not following through with their attacks. Go to punch then stop right before impact, making any attempt at redirection impossible. Sometimes they'd have to get really pissed off before they'd try a convincing strike.

Not the women of course, if you messed up the technique they'd ususally follow through and slug you from day one. :laugh:

Palomar · 2005-06-21 05:49:59

*Here I go again. I rarely get this wrapped up in a fictional story...however: How did Darth Vader come to recognize Luke as his son? Yes, I've seen Return of the Jedi. And unless I need to watch that movie again, it seems Vader just suddenly recognized Luke as his son. How and at what precise moment is a mystery (unless Lucas has given an explanation or it's been officially worked out in fan fiction).

Leia was aboard the Death Star in the 1st film, of course. Vader was in the small interrogation room when she was about to be tortured. He didn't sense she was his daughter? Didn't see the resemblance between her and Padme? Didn't think, "Hmmmm. She looks like someone I used to know. Like...my wife."

I really wish Lucas would do one more movie; a bridge between the 20-something-year gap. Did he believe Padme was truly dead, or perhaps her death had been staged and she'd been secreted off somewhere? He did think his children had survived, or was his memory impaired? Etc. etc.

But I'm still wondering at what point -- and how -- he came to realize Luke was his son. Of course finding out the guy's name is Luke Skywalker probably cinched it, huh? And unless "Skywalker" is a common name on Luke's adopted planet, wouldn't they have changed his last name?

Bah, I'd better get back to work. :-\ :laugh:

--Cindy

Grypd · 2005-06-21 06:09:35

Maybe he only found out when he discovered the name of the fighter pilot that destroyed the Death star and he was from tatooine and strong in the force.

He would have then just added 1 + 1 = 2 and since this boy was the nephew of his brother and named skywalker and strong in the force a bit of a shock for him I believe.

And leia though was adopted out of the family her last name was Organna so no surprise he did not recognise her.

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-21 06:14:08

*Here I go again. I rarely get this wrapped up in a fictional story...however: How did Darth Vader come to recognize Luke as his son? Yes, I've seen Return of the Jedi. And unless I need to watch that movie again, it seems Vader just suddenly recognized Luke as his son.

Well, In ANH he didn't seem know. He had that "the Force is strong with this one" comment during the Death Star run but nothing more than that. At the beginning of ESB he says, after the probe droid returned data from the rebel base, that "Skywalker is with them." As near as I can figure, Vader just hit the library or communed with the Force or something between those two movies and figured it out. I suppose it doesn't really matter much, but that's good enough for me.

(unless Lucas has given an explanation or it's been officially worked out in fan fiction).

EU is not canon! :laugh:
Sorry, a crazed fanboy I know keeps repeating that mantra whenever someone ties other works in to explain things in the movies.

Of course finding out the guy's name is Luke Skywalker probably cinched it, huh? And unless "Skywalker" is a common name on Luke's adopted planet, wouldn't they have changed his last name?

Yeah, looking at the saga in retrospect hiding Luke on his father's home planet, at his half-brother's house and keeping his name probably wasn't the best thing they could have come up with. But when it happened the Jedi weren't exactly overflowing with perceptiveness and wisdom, so I suppose it's all one could expect.

As for a "Episode 3.5", while I don't expect to see it (at least on the big screen, there's been some TV buzz for awhile) it could be interesting if done well. It wouldn't fit well into the whole Anakin/Luke story since nothing much happens on that front but there could still be some good stuff. Most likely that story is over, if they do anything more I'd expect it will be totally detached from the Anakin/Luke story even if the timing overlaps. There's just nothing much left to say but little details.

It might be best for them to just let it go.

Edited By Cobra Commander on 1119356122

Palomar · 2005-06-21 06:16:13

And leia though was adopted out of the family her last name was Organna so no surprise he did not recognise her.

*Yeah, but Vader is supposed to be so strong with the Dark Side of the Force.

You'd think the Emperor, with all his supposed powers, would have had a light bulb come on. Teehee.

Further proof Lucas didn't originally intend to turn this into a family affair.

--Cindy

Cobra Commander · 2005-06-21 06:31:40

Did anyone happen to catch the AFI Tribute to George Lucas that was on last night? My wife flipped it on a few minutes in. William Shatner did a musical number with a bunch of Stormtroopers.

Anyway, Carrie Fisher's speech was amusing. I chuckled a few times.

Palomar · 2005-06-21 06:39:58

Did anyone happen to catch the AFI Tribute to George Lucas that was on last night? My wife flipped it on a few minutes in.

*Saw maybe 10 minutes of it. Mostly other-director interviews (Steven Spielberg, etc.). Some video clips of the original trilogy.

William Shatner did a musical number with a bunch of Stormtroopers.

Good grief, I hope he didn't sing. Shatner cannot sing. Hmmmm...makes me wonder how miffed Shatner's been all these years that he couldn't/didn't get a gig in any of the Star Wars movies. And to be honest, I'm glad he didn't.

Anyway, Carrie Fisher's speech was amusing. I chuckled a few times.

Missed it, unfortunately. I still wonder why Lucas didn't give Fisher, Ford and Hamill cameo roles/appearances in the prequels...even if they'd been heavily disguised as aliens or whatever. Maybe it's best he didn't; an unnecessary distraction or he'd be criticized for it.

--Cindy

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