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#76 2008-05-19 10:58:49

bobunf
Member
From: Phoenix, AZ
Registered: 2005-11-21
Posts: 223

Re: Solar Federal Republic

“Makes the math simpler”  ???

"A transfer orbit is most economical, but sometimes time saved is more important than energy or reaction mass saved"

A transfer orbit is what optimizes whatever needs to be optimized--time, energy use or some combination.

I find it hard to take these EPs too seriously.  Maybe another word for EP could be illusion.

Bob

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#77 2008-05-19 11:15:22

bobunf
Member
From: Phoenix, AZ
Registered: 2005-11-21
Posts: 223

Re: Solar Federal Republic

“Some make work will be provided for real humans just to keep them healthy, happy, and busy, though not work that is too demanding of their time unless they want it.”

How’s this for an idea.  Some real human, disgusted with being kept healthy, happy and busy through make work, labors really hard at fomenting the revolution; melts all the damned machines, and becomes Solaris Khan, ruler of the Solar System.

That sounds a hell of a lot more interesting than all that virtual nonsense. 

And one can be sure, humans being what they are, that revolt will occur.

Thank God!

"ALL HAIL THE KHAN

Under penalty of death."

And the Khan doesn't do virtual.

Bob

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#78 2008-05-20 09:29:20

Tom Kalbfus
Banned
Registered: 2006-08-16
Posts: 4,401

Re: Solar Federal Republic

“Makes the math simpler”  ???

"A transfer orbit is most economical, but sometimes time saved is more important than energy or reaction mass saved"

A transfer orbit is what optimizes whatever needs to be optimized--time, energy use or some combination.

I find it hard to take these EPs too seriously.  Maybe another word for EP could be illusion.

Bob

It may be an illusion, but it is a mathematically precise and consistant illusion, and there is no such thing as illusionary intelligence, something either is intelligent or its not. What intelligent life ultimately boils down to is information. In our case our information which makes us us comes in the fome of organic molecules and cell structure, the information held in this form can also be stored electronically. Run the program and you have a computer simulation of life and if it is a good simulation the simulation will do precisely what real life would just as computer weather models predict the weather. It will take an awful lot of number crunching to simulate life, but at the rate we're going, I feel fairly certain that we'll have than number crunching capability by the 22nd century. To ignore that possibility is to ignore the microelectronics revolution that is going on today, and note: I am not asking you to believe in "magical" nanotechnology or anything of the sort, I am merely projecting today's computer trends 92 years into the future and coming up with this Electronic People concept.

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#79 2008-05-20 09:41:03

Tom Kalbfus
Banned
Registered: 2006-08-16
Posts: 4,401

Re: Solar Federal Republic

“Some make work will be provided for real humans just to keep them healthy, happy, and busy, though not work that is too demanding of their time unless they want it.”

How’s this for an idea.  Some real human, disgusted with being kept healthy, happy and busy through make work, labors really hard at fomenting the revolution; melts all the damned machines, and becomes Solaris Khan, ruler of the Solar System.

That sounds a hell of a lot more interesting than all that virtual nonsense. 

And one can be sure, humans being what they are, that revolt will occur.

Thank God!

"ALL HAIL THE KHAN

Under penalty of death."

And the Khan doesn't do virtual.

Bob

Alot of the stuff we do today is virtual, there are online rudimentary multiplayer games that are virtual, and real transactions occur there. There are also primitive 'bots' that challenge the players in these games and there is real artificial intelligence behind these 'bots', and each year their intelligence gets more and more sophisticated. Now tell me, if we can get an Artificial Intellignce program to guide the actions of a real robot, why not also that of a virtual character in a massive multi-user game? These "bots" are the forerunners of Electronic People. When we have androids that can mimic a human in every way, we will also have virtual characters that do the same. A virtual character can also direct the actions of a real robot, that robot can serve you coffee, clean your room, or mine the asteroids, they can do real work, just as robots assemble cars and do other things in today's factories, the concept is not to be laughed at.

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#80 2008-05-20 09:48:05

Tom Kalbfus
Banned
Registered: 2006-08-16
Posts: 4,401

Re: Solar Federal Republic

“Makes the math simpler”  ???

"A transfer orbit is most economical, but sometimes time saved is more important than energy or reaction mass saved"

A transfer orbit is what optimizes whatever needs to be optimized--time, energy use or some combination.

I find it hard to take these EPs too seriously.  Maybe another word for EP could be illusion.

Bob

The simpler math is not just for me, but also the general reader, if I were to introduce some comples equations for the functions of transfer orbits, I would quickly lose alot of the readers reading this, but keep it as simple high school math and algebra, then I can demostrate the travel times and explain what I'm doing that much clearer, and as with your mistake in questioning why I use "velocity squared" to represent acceleration, we all make mathematical mistakes, by keeping the math relatively simple, I'm reducing the chances of making such mistakes. Oh by the way, I've corrected the travel times for the antimatter rockets from Earth to various planets. Previously I forgot to take into account the deceleration for half of the trip, now I have. For all of the planets except Neptune, the ship accelerates for half the trip at 1-G and decelerates for the second half of the trip, for Neptune, I assume a small amount of coasting for the fuel only lasts 14.5 days. The other .1 day is uses to match velocities with Neptune and do other things like land in its atmosphere.

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#81 2008-05-20 14:25:13

Gregori
Member
From: Baile Atha Cliath, Eireann
Registered: 2008-01-13
Posts: 297

Re: Solar Federal Republic

To get millions of people living in outerspace in the next 200 years would require a breakthrough in energy and propulsion - probably Fusion.

Having Fusion Power and propulsion would enable us obtain minerals from all over the solar system to build space craft and colonies pretty much anywhere.

Anti-Matter might become doable if we discover a way to create and store loads of it efficiently. CERN LHC will tell us more about that soon.

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#82 2008-05-21 08:12:48

Tom Kalbfus
Banned
Registered: 2006-08-16
Posts: 4,401

Re: Solar Federal Republic

One possibility is that the magnetic field of Jupiter might be an effective antimatter trap for antiprotons produced by cosmic rays colliding with ring particles. What antimatter needs is alot of vacuum, and a huge cross section of magnetic field to trap the particles with a low probability of them coming in contact with matter, hence a certain rate of cosmic ray collisions will create a "reservoir" of antimatter particles trapped in Jupiter's magnetic field. It might take less energy to collect the antimatter from these natural antimatter accumulators than it would to manufacture them. It all depends on how efficient the process of manufacturing antimatter would be.

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#83 2017-03-13 10:46:33

JohnX
Member
From: Thunder Bay
Registered: 2017-03-10
Posts: 73
Website

Re: Solar Federal Republic

Gregori wrote:

To get millions of people living in outerspace in the next 200 years would require a breakthrough in energy and propulsion - probably Fusion.

Having Fusion Power and propulsion would enable us obtain minerals from all over the solar system to build space craft and colonies pretty much anywhere.

Anti-Matter might become doable if we discover a way to create and store loads of it efficiently. CERN LHC will tell us more about that soon.

Want to revisit the dream of the Solar Federal Republic now that EM Drives are beginning to look like they might actually work? (as much as that offends all our scientific sensibilities) Sure, they might not be much use for heavy lifting out of Earth's gravity well, but from there on an EM fleet could push solar system colonisation.


-- Because it's there! --

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