Mars Express (MEX) - ESA orbiter

Palomar · 2004-11-12 07:08:34

Is Phobos some broken-off chunk of Mars? Did Phobos form in a localized gravity well that caused particulate matter to gather up from bottom to top in well-defined layers?
Perhaps we'll never know.

*The most popular theory seems to be Phobos (and Deimos too) was originally an asteroid which became caught by Mars' gravity.

As for this particular:

This tiny moon is thought to be in a ‘death spiral’, slowly orbiting toward the surface of Mars. Here, Phobos was found to be about five kilometres ahead of its predicted orbital position. This could be an indication of an increased orbital speed associated with its secular acceleration, causing the moon to spiral in toward Mars.
Eventually Phobos could be torn apart by Martian gravity and become a short-lived ring around Mars, or even impact on the surface. This orbit will be studied in more detail over the lifetime of the Mars Express.

*I read an article a long while back (and posted it somewhere here at New Mars then, around 1-1/2 years ago) that Phobos may -- in the far future -- shatter and form a ring around Mars.

Interesting about the "marked albedo variations," and what's that whitish streak with what looks like a "loop" at its end, on the edge of the big crater?

--Cindy

Shaun Barrett · 2004-11-12 07:49:39

Hmmm .. Yeah.
Presumably anything white could be highly reflective water ice but I would have thought direct sunlight would cause it to sublime away into space. ???

But, if you care to play Rohrschach Tests, it looks to me like an oblique view of an upside-down Egyptian Ahnk. Quick .. somebody phone Richard Hoagland!

Palomar · 2004-11-12 07:57:13

But, if you care to play Rohrschach Tests, it looks to me like an oblique view of an upside-down Egyptian Ahnk. Quick .. somebody phone Richard Hoagland!

*I thought it looked like an upside-down ankh as well. :laugh:

Yeah, I suppose "the fringe" will try to make something woo-woo mystical out of it.

--Cindy

hubricide · 2004-11-12 19:57:33

If Phobos is an asteroid, why does it have the grooves? The only way such features could form that I can think of is by layering of deposits.. if it were to fly through some sort of 'scouring' field (tiny bits of rock) it seems like it would look sandblasted, not covered in parallel grooves.

SpaceNut · 2004-11-12 20:47:51

I would say that the streaking is from when it was struck on the side where the impact occurred in the distant past. Just project the trace into space on each streak. I would surmise that the moon was larger back then, than it is now.

This color and texture also reminds me of places in utah, maybe this is a crunch from Earth..?..

Sort of hard to enoy 3 D views without the glasses.

remcook · 2004-11-13 04:20:45

This could be an indication of an increased orbital speed associated with its secular acceleration, causing the moon to spiral in toward Mars.

ehm...this doesn't look right. an extra acceleration of Phobos would increase its orbital height. I think they mean it the other way around. A decelration causes the height of the orbit to decrease, hence making it speed up (low orbits have higher velocities).

Palomar · 2004-11-17 13:55:03

http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish … ]Collapsed Canyons

:up:

a few landslides are visible. Scientists theorize that underlying ice or water was removed, which then caused the rock and soil to collapse.

*The stunning gold, copper and cinnamon colors of Mars never fail to delight me. So beautiful. Hmmm...I wonder what that brighter gold/yellow "squiggle" near the bottom is. I guess the explanation is: "On the valley floor, brighter layers are exposed, which could be material of the same composition as seen in other parts of Valles Marineris, where sulphates have been measured by the OMEGA spectrometer instrument."

These collapsed structures vary between 2500 and 3000 metres deep, which is far less than the depth of the main valley at 8000 metres. A few landslides can be seen on the valley walls.

--Cindy

Shaun Barrett · 2004-11-17 20:03:30

Cindy:-

Hmmm...I wonder what that brighter gold/yellow "squiggle" near the bottom is.

Yes, it looks reflective enough to be a vein of gold, doesn't it?!
But I suppose it's just a mundane salt of some description, caught at just the right angle by the Sun shining through suspended red dust in the atmosphere, to give us that golden sheen. Pretty, though.
:up:

Palomar · 2004-11-24 14:47:32

http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish … 004]Impact Crater Hale

*Taken in June 2004. Is in Argyle basin.

Also (a bonus):

Slight periodic colour and brightness variations in parts of the image indicate atmospheric waves in clouds.

Gravity waves? What's the cause of those atmospheric waves (besides possible wind cause)?

There is even evidence at the bottom of the picture of a network of fluvial channels, which were probably caused by running water.

--Cindy

Shaun Barrett · 2004-11-24 21:12:08

Gravity waves are extremely weak, which is why they've never been detected up to now. They couldn't be responsible for those cloud waves.
My guess is it's probably to do with the high-speed winds blowing across the crater walls. You know how blowing across the mouth of an empty bottle produces a sound? This is due to pressure oscillations in the air, setting up standing waves inside the bottle - if I remember my highschool physics correctly.
I suspect similar pressure oscillations, though at a much lower frequency, are produced by wind blowing across a crater. This may be the cause of the clouds' wave pattern in the thin air above the crater floor.

Palomar · 2004-11-25 07:51:06

Gravity waves are extremely weak, which is why they've never been detected up to now. They couldn't be responsible for those cloud waves.
My guess is it's probably to do with the high-speed winds blowing across the crater walls. You know how blowing across the mouth of an empty bottle produces a sound? This is due to pressure oscillations in the air, setting up standing waves inside the bottle - if I remember my highschool physics correctly.
I suspect similar pressure oscillations, though at a much lower frequency, are produced by wind blowing across a crater. This may be the cause of the clouds' wave pattern in the thin air above the crater floor.

*Well, there is http://www.space.com/imageoftheday/imag … .html]this photo (Earth), which I found and posted early this year in the old "Weather Watching" thread (the first one).

Those Marsian clouds aren't very substantial and of course Mars has lower gravity than us. So I'm thinking in terms of ratio.

Just wondering. I like speculating about weather phenomena, especially what little of it (besides wind!) Mars gets. Seems similar to the explanation you gave, but then physics isn't my best topic. :-\

--Cindy

Shaun Barrett · 2004-11-25 08:42:13

Oops!
I wasn't aware of the term 'gravity waves' being used in meteorology. I assumed, incorrectly, that you were referring to the kind of gravity waves LIGO is being tuned to detect. A stupid mistake.

Pardon me but my ignorance is showing!

My apologies for completely misinterpreting what you meant. If I'd paid more attention in meteorology classes in school ..

Yang Liwei Rocket · 2004-11-25 10:12:47

Quiet a good angle on the view into the crater

http://www.esa.int/images/136-021104-05 … ater_L.jpg

Palomar · 2004-11-25 10:26:20

Quiet a good angle on the view into the crater
http://www.esa.int/images/136-021104-05 … ater_L.jpg

*Quite a good angle...understatement! Wow, awesome photo. I wonder how fine/fluffy/compacted/deep the soil within the crater is. Seems to have a slightly greenish cast to it (maybe my eyes/monitor). Have been looking for additional details, such as depth of the crater, etc.; haven't found it yet.

--Cindy

::edit:: Whoops. Click on "Original Source: ESA News Release" link in the article I posted on Crater Hale and there are even more photos! :up: How'd I miss that originally? :hm: Too busy preparing for Thanksgiving, I guess. Heres]http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Mars_Express/SEM8AVWJD1E_0.html]Here's the link

Palomar · 2004-12-08 13:33:23

http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish … 4]Channels at Reull Valles

*Photo taken during Orbit 451, in May 2004. Outflow channel 12.4 miles wide x 932 miles long. Southern hemisphere of Mars -- stretches across Promethei Terra. Mentions impact craters in the area

filled with material from flowing glaciers which have long since disappeared.

-also-

Distinct parallel structures are visible in the channels, possibly caused by glacial flow of loose debris mixed with ice. Small depressions, located on the flow features, are probably caused by the sublimation of ice.

--Cindy

djellison · 2004-12-08 14:06:37

Still nothing - almost a year after arriving at mars - published from the 2m res Super Res Camera

Doug

Palomar · 2004-12-08 14:43:22

Still nothing - almost a year after arriving at mars - published from the 2m res Super Res Camera
Doug

*Gosh, I hadn't thought of that in a while. :hm:

I wonder why not?? ???

But the images coming back from ME are nothing short of spectacular. Yum, can almost feel the sand and grit of Mars beneath my hands.

Maybe it's not operating correctly and they've just not said anything about it? But it seems what photos ARE released from ME are a bit infrequent (or more infrequent than I care for <grin>).

--Cindy

Palomar · 2004-12-08 14:56:46

http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish … 4]Channels at Reull Valles
*Photo taken during Orbit 451, in May 2004. Outflow channel 12.4 miles wide x 932 miles long. Southern hemisphere of Mars -- stretches across Promethei Terra. Mentions impact craters in the area
filled with material from flowing glaciers which have long since disappeared.
-also-
Distinct parallel structures are visible in the channels, possibly caused by glacial flow of loose debris mixed with ice. Small depressions, located on the flow features, are probably caused by the sublimation of ice.
--Cindy

Heres]http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Mars_Express/SEM1EQWDE2E_0.html]Here's more of Reull Valles

*Cripes, from now on I'll just skip over to the ESA-ME site, when an ME pic is posted elsewhere. Really like the image the bottom of the page.

Oh, and going back to Doug's comment: I searched for some information at ESA's web site; guess I'll have to dig a bit more extensively.

--Cindy

djellison · 2004-12-08 15:17:56

oh - I LOVE the MEX stuff coming down in colour and 3D - I wish they'd release it as vrmls or DEMs with textures - as I really want to spin around and roatate around these things

Doug

Yang Liwei Rocket · 2004-12-08 16:00:13

oh - I LOVE the MEX stuff coming down in colour and 3D - I wish they'd release it as vrmls or DEMs with textures - as I really want to spin around and roatate around these things
Doug

Did you take out those red-blue 3D specs ? There is so much happening in this image, I wonder what those strange features are and how they were caused

great picture

http://esamultimedia.esa.int/images/mar … ...l_H.jpg

Palomar · 2004-12-22 12:55:34

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/m … .html]Mars volcanoes possibly STILL ACTIVE?

*...Mars Express in the news again. Dang, I wanted to create a new thread for this but thought I should post it here for purposes of continuity. :-\

Images from a European space probe reveal recent glacial deposits and lava flows on Mars that suggest the red planet is more active than many scientists had thought.
The European Space Agency's Mars Express orbiter photographed lava flows that must have occurred within the past two million years and imply, scientists say,
that volcanoes on Mars might still pump molten rock to the surface now and then.

They're so confident that one scientist even mentions the hope of actually "seeing some action" [ ] that ME might be fortunate enough to capture!

Five volcanoes included in this:

Olympus Mons, Ascraeus Mons, Arsia Mons, Albor Tholus and Hecates Tholus

Discusses similarities of volcanic flow patterns to volcanoes in Hawaii.

--Cindy

Palomar · 2004-12-23 09:25:20

http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Mars_Expres … html]Walls of Candor Chasma

*Looking northwest. Elevation approximately 6 km. That's quite a mesa! Very nice; the usual ME superb quality.

--Cindy

P.S.: Don't miss the article above this post, about Mars volcanoes! Article is dated only yesterday.

Yang Liwei Rocket · 2004-12-27 01:44:17

Those views are great, it seems like a very good region to get info I wonder what else they could image in this area
looks like they have a lot to choose from

http://www.esa.int/images/143-161204-03 … ctxt_L.jpg

Palomar · 2005-01-20 12:04:14

http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish … 5]Claritas Fossae

*New from the ever-wonderful Mars Express. :up:

Located on the Tharsis rise, south of the Tharsis Montes.

Very rugged. I wonder what percentage of Mars' surface is relatively smooth/flat?

Those discolored areas are interesting -- looks like a dull bile green. Not related to any shadowing. ???

--Cindy

Yang Liwei Rocket · 2005-01-20 13:13:30

nice story by Universe today

I think the 3-D effect is great

http://esamultimedia.esa.int/images/mar … ...a_H.jpg

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