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For SpaceNut re baton images!
Thanks very much ... The vision of two Starships joined with a cylindrical passageway between the ships is much easier (for me at least)!
For SpaceNut .... your suggestion of the docking ports seems (again, to me at least) to be a good fit with the cylindrical passageway.
GW Johnson suggested something along those lines.
(th)
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Time to Launch a Bio-Satellite, I say Half G
Void says g forces of 0 to .5 could be tested in LEO.
Tahanson43206 made references to others and talks about tests of 38 percent the gravity vs Earth
GW Johnson advocate staying near 1 gee, because that is what we evolved in.
SpaceNut says an experiment can be done but doesn't give a number
I might even suggest boosting to 1 point zero 5 Gravity or 1.2 G to harden them up during the return journey back to Earth, if it works perhaps one day Athlete Olympians might train in higher gravity.
Even though we debate and explore different ideas we already agree an experiment must be done and already should have been done, especially with other Nations entering space and catching up.
a small Biosphere, some plants a few mice and some fish and frogs
Orbiting Frog Otolith (OFO) was a NASA space program which sent two bullfrogs into orbit
https://web.archive.org/web/20060929213 … w/OFO.html
Bion satellites also named Biocosmos, a series of Soviet and later Russian biosatellites
https://web.archive.org/web/20120602211 … t/bion.htm
However even if you gave animals a perfect place to live, they might still die.
'Universe 25: The Mouse "Utopia" Experiment That Turned Into An Apocalypse'
https://www.iflscience.com/universe-25- … ypse-60407
When the population hit 620, that slowed to doubling around every 145 days, as the mouse society began to hit problems. The mice split off into groups, and those that could not find a role in these groups found themselves with nowhere to go.
Rodents are considered pests and notorious breeders, so beofre anything launched the population inside a spinning Biodome experiment Sat can be controlled, inside the Biosphere perhaps first Mouse Castration could be done to our Animal Astronaut or perhaps the Female mouse also sterilize uterus Ovaries, another mission would be launched on future Sats and health of breeding populations could be checked after inside other Bio-Sats.
Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2022-09-06 06:20:53)
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For Mars_B4_Moon re #27
Thank you for finding and posting the link to a report on the mouse study.
It seems to me that the discussion of possible application of the experiment to the human condition is worth continuing.
A key concept is lack of control of aggressive individuals.
Vladimir Putin is a good example of an aggressive individual who was NOT controlled by his society. The result is ruin for thousands of individuals, and potentially for millions.
The lesson I take from a first reading of this article, is the wisdom of insuring every member of society has a role that is satisfying. The Utopia aspect of the experiment would apply in a confined environment such as the Large Ship three of our members are designing, or at least thinking about. The physical needs of everyone would be met.
I take from the article a reminder that meeting the psychological needs of the humans who might be embarked upon a journey of long duration is just as important as meeting the physical needs.
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Want to Stay Healthy in Space? Then you Want Artificial Gravity
https://www.universetoday.com/157510/wa … l-gravity/
2022 Matt Williams
In this study, the team conducted a month-long investigation using the Multi-use Variable-gravity Platform (MVP), a centrifuge-based commercial testbed that arrived on the ISS in 2019. This experiment has distinct compartments and provides flies with fresh food as they live and reproduce. This allowed the team to house different generations of flies separately and under different levels of gravity, with one exposed to microgravity (like their astronaut counterparts aboard the ISS) and another exposed to Earth-like gravity (9.8 m/s2, or 1 g).
The research team then monitored their behavior using cameras embedded in the hardware. At different points, some of the flies were frozen and returned to Earth for analysis to see how the different levels of gravity affected their gene expression and its impact on their nervous systems. As Dr. Janani Iyer, a USRA project scientist at NASA’s Ames Research Center, explained in a recent NASA press release:
“Microgravity poses risks to the central nervous system, suggesting that countermeasures may be needed for long-duration space travel. As we venture back to the Moon and on to Mars, reducing the harmful effects of microgravity will be key to keeping future explorers safe. This study is a step in the right direction to explore the protective effects of artificial gravity in space and to understand the adaptation to Earth conditions after returning from space.”
Fruit flies are the ideal organism for this kind of research because of their similarities to humans in terms of cellular and molecular processes and their short lifespans and reproduction cycles (two months and two weeks, respectively). Almost 75% of the genes that cause disease in humans are shared by fruit flies, meaning changes in their gene expression will resemble possible changes in humans. In addition, the three weeks they spend in space is equivalent to about thirty years of a human’s life, allowing scientists to observe decades worth of biological information in a short amount of time.
Among the behaviors studied, the scientists examined how the flies climbed the walls of their container – a natural response fruit flies have when tapped down. They found that the flies in microgravity were more active than those exposed to artificial gravity but experienced difficulty during the climbing test upon their return to Earth. The post-flight analysis also revealed the flies exposed to microgravity experienced neurological changes while those exposed to artificial gravity aged differently and faced less severe challenges acclimating once they returned.
These results suggest that spaceflight causes stress that leads to negative behavioral and neurological effects, as well as changes in gene expression in the fly brain. They also suggest that artificial gravity can mitigate these effects during spaceflight, though there are still long-term challenges when it comes to reacclimating to Earth. While these results cannot precisely predict the effects on human health, they offer an approximation and a good starting point for future research. As Dr. Siddhita Mhatre, a KBR Wyle senior scientist at Ames and an author of the paper, summarized:
“With the upcoming long-duration deep space missions, where astronauts will be exposed to varying levels of gravity, it is imperative that we understand the impacts of altered gravity on the neurological function. If we can use artificial gravity to delay space-related deficits, maybe we can extend the future mission timelines. And flies in space, alongside the astronauts, will help to further our efforts in keeping astronauts healthy.”
NASA is currently investigating centrifuges and artificial gravity for space stations and missions to deep space. Examples include the NASA concept study titled “Non-Atmospheric Universal Transport Intended for Lengthy United States Exploration” (NAUTILUS-X), a rotating torus-shaped module that would provide artificial gravity. NASA further proposed that a demonstration module (the ISS Centrifuge Demo) could become a Sleep Module for the ISS crew. This module would measure 9.1 m (30 feet) in diameter, have an interior diameter of 0.76 m (2.5 feet), and provide between 0.08 to 0.51 g of partial gravity.
It was also intended to provide a proof-of-concept for a larger torus that could be integrated into a possible spacecraft known as the Multi-Mission Space Exploration Vehicle (MMSEV). This concept and similar research studies highlight the importance of astronaut health and safety measures for long-duration spaceflights. As NASA and other space agencies send astronauts to the Moon (to stay this time) and pursue crewed missions to Mars and beyond, artificial gravity may become a regular feature of spacecraft, space stations, and even surface habitats.
Space mechanism Skyhook is a proposed momentum exchange tether to reduce the cost of placing payloads into low Earth orbit, the orbiting station is connected to a cable which extends down towards the upper atmosphere. Payloads, which are much lighter than the station, are hooked to the end of the cable as it passes, and are then flung into orbit by rotation of the cable around the center of mass. The skyhook differs from geostationary space elevators in that a skyhook would be shorter and not come in contact with the surface of the Earth.
https://web.archive.org/web/20071006101 … nSpace.pdf
Scifi?
McKendree cylinder is a type of hypothetical rotating space habitat proposed at NASA's Turning Goals into Reality conference in 2000 by NASA engineer Tom McKendree.
http://www.zyvex.com/nanotech/nano4/mckendreePaper.html
1000 km in radius and 10,000 km long, containing 63 million km2 (24 million sq mi) of living space — greater than the continent of Eurasia.
Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2022-09-13 17:48:20)
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New findings from a study using fruit flies on the International Space Station suggest that space travel has an impact on the central nervous system
https://markets.businessinsider.com/new … 1031730273
NASA's 5 Hazards Of Human Spaceflight Explained
https://www.slashgear.com/983400/nasas- … explained/
Many medical issues explained, it could also go in the psychological issues and one of the new mars mental health threads
One of the biggest differences between being on Earth and being on space is gravity. The lack of it in space always needs to be accounted for, as it can have plenty of unforeseen effects. This includes on the bodies of astronauts as well. First, their bodies need to acclimate to the loss of gravity, which can be a jarring experience in and of itself. They'll then need to spend months or years, depending on the mission, in this lessened state of gravity. This can cause problems such as muscle degeneration, loss of bone density, and vision issues, NASA reports.
After spending such a long time in different fields of gravity, they would then need to reacclimate to Earth's gravity. Again, this would be very shocking to the body, and there would be impacts to the astronauts bones, blood vessels, and muscles. Strategies are being developed by NASA to counteract these problems, some of the most long-lasting ones for an astronaut to endure, including artificial gravity.
Artificial gravity reduces spaceflight's health toll in fruit fly tests
https://newatlas.com/space/artificial-g … uit-flies/
Vast Launches With Mission to Develop the World’s First Artificial-Gravity Space Station
https://spaceref.com/space-commerce/vas … e-station/
A crypto billionaire is joining the race for private space stations
https://sg.news.yahoo.com/crypto-billio … 00363.html
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Vast Space to develop artificial-gravity space station
https://spacenews.com/vast-space-intro/
McCaleb envisions a future where millions of people are living throughout the solar system. Since other companies are helping to reduce launch costs, McCaleb thinks the next important step will be creating large structures where people can live and work in space.
“Earth has finite resources, but out in the solar system, there is an enormous untapped wealth, both in terms of energy and matter, that could support many ‘Earths,'” McCaleb told SpaceNews by email. “Likewise, mankind needs a frontier. Every prosperous civilization has had one to push off into – nevertheless, we haven’t had one for some time. Without a frontier, the world becomes a zero-sum game, which is detrimental to the psyche of a civilization. And in terms of the long-term future of humanity, we will need to live off of the Earth eventually.”
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Routines needed to keep good health
Astronaut demos microgravity yoga on International Space Station
https://www.space.com/astronaut-does-yoga-in-space
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Last week, Space_Station crew conducted scientific investigations that included collecting data to support studies of how the body adapts to space, mapping radiation doses inside the space station, and more!
https://twitter.com/ISS_Research/status … 8789727232
Startup Vast Space wants to take artificial gravity station concept for a spin
https://www.space.com/vast-artificial-g … tocurrency
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Experiments to complete scientific understanding of how reduced gravity affects boiling and condensation
https://phys.org/news/2023-02-scientifi … ation.html
Air pollution increases bone loss from osteoporosis
https://www.earth.com/news/air-pollutio … eoporosis/
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How Does The Immune System React To Altered Gravity?
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What Can Be Done to Help Astronaut Vision in Space?
https://www.universetoday.com/160912/wh … -in-space/
Spaceflight takes a serious toll on the human body. As NASA’s Twin Study demonstrates, long-duration stays in space lead to muscle and bone density loss. There are also notable effects on the cardiovascular, central nervous, and endocrine systems, as well as changes in gene expression and cognitive function. There’s also visual impairment, known as Spaceflight-Associated Neuro-ocular Syndrome (SANS), which many astronauts reported after spending two months aboard the International Space Station (ISS). This results from increased intracranial pressure that places stress on the optic nerve and leads to temporary blindness.
How does space affect men and women differently?
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/sp … ifferently
Study Investigates How Men and Women Adapt Differently to Spaceflight
https://www.nasa.gov/content/men-women- … adaptation
summary of the Sex & Gender work groups' major findings is listed below:
Orthostatic Intolerance, or the inability to stand without fainting for protracted periods, is more prevalent upon landing in female astronauts than in their male counterparts. One possible reason for this observed difference in orthostatic intolerance between the sexes is reduced leg vascular compliance, which was demonstrated in bed-rest studies – which is a ground analog for spaceflight.
Women have greater loss of blood plasma volume than men during spaceflight, and women’s stress response characteristically includes a heart rate increase while men respond with an increase in vascular resistance. Still, these Earth observations require further study in space.
The VIIP syndrome (visual impairment / intracranial pressure) manifests with anatomical ocular changes, ranging from mild to clinically significant, with a range of corresponding changes in visual function. Currently 82% of male astronauts vs. 62% of women astronauts (who have flown in space) are affected. However, all clinically significant cases so far have occurred in male astronauts.
Changes in function and concentration of key constituents of the immune system related to spaceflight have been reported. However, differences between male and female immune responses have not been observed in space. On the ground, women mount a more potent immune response than men, which makes them more resistant to viral and bacterial infections; once infected, women mount an even more potent response. This response, however, makes women more susceptible to autoimmune diseases. It is not clear if these changes on the ground will occur during longer space missions, or missions that involve planetary exploration (exposure to gravity).
Radiation presents a major hazard for space travel. It has been reported that female subjects are more susceptible to radiation-induced cancer than their male counterparts; hence radiation permissible exposure levels are lower for women than men astronauts.
Upon transition to microgravity after arriving at the International Space Station (ISS), female astronauts reported a slightly higher incidence of space motion sickness (SMS) compared with men. Conversely, more men experience motion-sickness symptoms upon return to Earth. These data were however not statistically significant, due both to the relatively small sample sizes and small differences in the incidence of SMS reported by the men and women astronauts.
Hearing sensitivity, when measured at several frequencies, declines with age much more rapidly in male astronauts than it does in female astronauts. No evidence suggests that the sex-based hearing differences in the astronaut population are related to microgravity exposure.
The human musculoskeletal response to gravity unloading is highly variable among individuals and a sex-based difference was not observed.
Urinary tract infections in space are more common in women and have been successfully treated with antibiotics.
There is no evidence of sex differences in terms of behavioral or psychological responses to spaceflight. Analysis of ISS astronauts’ neurobehavioral performance and sleep measures showed no sex or gender differences using the Psychomotor Vigilance Test (PVT) of alertness and Visual Analog Scales of workload, stress, and sleep quality. Since all all astronaut candidates undergo a robust process of psychological screening and selection, the likelihood of an adverse behavioral health condition or psychiatric disorder is greatly diminished.
Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-04-14 04:51:40)
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Sex in Space: Consideration of uncontrolled human conception in emerging space tourism
https://zenodo.org/record/7852203#.ZEfLEnZByUk
Mammalian development in space
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/14631635/
Whereas studies of mid-pregnant rats in space have been extraordinarily successful, studies of young rat litters launched at 9 days of postnatal age or earlier, have been encumbered with problems related to the design of in-flight caging and compromised maternal-offspring interactions. Possibilities for mammalian birth in space, an event that has not yet transpired, are considered.
As I understand it NASA and other space agency had trouble having animals reproduce in Space but there might have been nematode, or roundworm, able to reproduce fully in space from mating through development, some small Japanese rice fish small ray-finned fish that are found in fresh and brackish waters I believe fruit flies reproduced in space and 'cockroaches' of course a species that is predict that could survive a 'Nuclear Winter' and maybe Tardigrades one of the most hardy tiny durable species to exist.
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Artificial Gravity Tests on Earth Could Improve Astronaut Health in Space
https://www.universetoday.com/161540/ar … -in-space/
Musk's SpaceX To Launch The World’s First Artificial Gravity Space Station HAVEN-1 In 2025
https://www.republicworld.com/science/s … eshow.html
Vast And SpaceX To Test Artificial Gravity On Commercial Space Station
https://aviationweek.com/aerospace/comm … ce-station
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Eric Berger: NASA says it is working with SpaceX on potentially turning Starship into a space station. "This architecture includes Starship as a transportation and in-space low-Earth orbit destination..."
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Space travel alters gene expression in white blood cells, weakening our immune system
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Haven-1 is a planned private station in low Earth orbit currently in development by American aerospace company Vast, there are announcements it will perhaps test Artificial Gravity and maybe approximately lunar gravity, or one-sixth that of Earth's gravity. There is also much speculation in news media about the Chinese Space Program, future space stations and if they will look at going to the Moon and Mars again or go to the outer planets or maybe even do all of these future missions.
NASA's SLS and Gateway is going head
NASA will use ChatGPT-like AI to allow its lunar Gateway station to 'talk'
https://interestingengineering.com/inno … ar-gateway
NASA Rocket Flight Software for Artemis II Moon Mission Meets Testing Checkpoint
https://spacecoastdaily.com/2023/07/nas … heckpoint/
Cancelled projects included Russian Soveit plans for Stations, the British making a private station and using old Soviet parts, the Columbus Man-Tended Free Flyer
https://web.archive.org/web/20121006071 … lrmtff.htm
European manned space station. Study 1986.
Lunar Orbital Station is or perhaps was a proposed Russian space station in orbit around the Moon. It might be still active, In October 2020, Dmitry Rogozin, the former director general of Roscosmos, said that the Lunar Gateway program was too “U.S.-centric” for Roscosmos to participate in.
https://spacenews.com/russia-skeptical- … r-gateway/
Soyuz is no longer in French Guiana and here have been cancellations of Russia-European missions since the invasion of Ukraine.
Hindu News items reported ISRO Space Station is a planned space station to be constructed by India. The Hindustan Times originally planned to be launched in 2030, it was further postponed to 2035 due to delays led by technical issues related with the Gaganyaan crewed spaceflight mission and the COVID-19 pandemic.
https://www.hindustantimes.com/science/ … 87541.html
Starlab is the name given to the planned LEO space station designed by Nanoracks for commercial space activities uses. The company released preliminary plans in October 2021. The main structure of Starlab consists of a large inflatable habitat to be built by Lockheed Martin and a metallic docking node. In 2023 it was announced Airbus would join the Starlab project.
https://spacenews.com/airbus-joins-star … on-project
Orbital Reef is a planned low Earth orbit (LEO) space station designed by Blue Origin. The company Blue Origin has referred to it as a "mixed-use business park". https://www.npr.org/2021/10/25/10490773 … reef-bezos
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Astronauts' immune systems could be disturbed by microgravity, scientists find
https://www.space.com/astronauts-immune … tists-find
As a new era of crewed space exploration approaches, with prolonged missions to the moon and Mars planned for the coming decades, scientists are taking a closer look at how the environment of space can negatively impact the immune systems of astronauts.
In particular, a team from the Karolinska Institutet in Sweden looked at how microgravity experienced by space travelers could affect T-cells. A T-cell is a type of white blood cell, called a lymphocyte, that's crucial in fighting off disease.
The team's results could help explain why any changes to astronauts’ T cells that happen in space can persist back on Earth. Such lasting changes may lead to T cells becoming less active and less effective at fighting infection, making astronauts vulnerable to reoccurrence of latent viruses.
This will be something space agencies will likely want to know about as they start sending people to locations beyond Earth. NASA, for instance, is already looking to a future that includes lunar, and even Martian, travelers. With its Artemis 3 mission, a crew including the first woman and person of color is expected to head to the moon in 2025. And future efforts, the agency says, will possibly take humans to the surface of Mars as soon as the 2030s.
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Deep Space Exploration Will Demand Artificial Gravity
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucedormi … l-gravity/
Biotech Research on Station Promoting Astronaut Health
https://blogs.nasa.gov/spacestation/202 … ut-health/
Variable-g Platform, a biology research device that can generate artificial gravity.
MVP a new commercial test bed for centrifuge based science
2018 Spinning Science Multi-use Variable-g Platform Arrives at the Space Station
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzUXMrhAY28
For MVP’s hardware validation run, one carousel will stay stationary to allow scientists to collect a baseline of behavior in microgravity. The other carousel will spin at the normal force of gravity on Earth (1 g) as control group.
https://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/stat … ves_At_ISS
In addition to validating the controls and operability of MVP, this initial investigation – known as MVP-Fly-01 - will provide science data for researchers at NASA’s Ames Research Center. MVP is especially exciting for fruit fly research because it can host larger samples for multiple generations. This initial study will look at biological issues common between humans and fruit flies.
Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-09-18 09:26:49)
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For Mars_B4_Moon re #43 ...
Thank you for finding and posting the link to the news of an artificial gravity experiment on the Space Station!
(th)
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What does spending more than a year in space do to the human body?
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/2023 … human-body
Nasa astronaut Frank Rubio has just returned from a record-breaking 371 days in space onboard the ISS, but the trip may have altered his muscles, brain and even the bacteria living in his gut.
WWith a few handshakes, a brief photoshoot and a wave, Nasa astronaut Frank Rubio bid farewell to the American-football-field-sized collection of modules and solar panels that has been his home for the past 371 days. His departure from the International Space Station (ISS) and return to Earth marks the end of the longest single spaceflight by an American to date.
His time in orbit – which surpassed the previous US record of 355 consecutive days – was extended in March after the spacecraft he and his crewmates had been due to fly home in developed a coolant leak. The extra months in space allowed Rubio to clock up a total of 5,963 orbits around the Earth, travelling 157.4 million miles (253.3 million km). But it still means he is around two months short of the record for the longest ever spaceflight by a human – Russian cosmonaut Valeri Polyakov spent 437 days onboard the Mir Space Station in the mid 1990s.
With a huge grin on his face, Rubio was carried from the Soyuz MS-23 spacecraft after it bumped safely back to Earth in a cloud of dust near the town of Zhezkazgan in the Kazakhstan Steppe. Spending so much time in the low gravity environment of the ISS will have taken a toll on his body, so he had to be lifted out of the capsule by the recovery teams.
NASA blog
https://blogs.nasa.gov/stationreport/20 … 9-01-2023/
Payloads
Multi-use Variable-g Platform-02 Cell-02 (MVP Cell-02): The crew gained access to the MVP Cell-02 facility and removed the Cell-02 science from the facility. The MVP Cell-02 investigation seeks to understand how organisms adapt to the space environment, an important component of future space exploration. Microbes may play fundamental roles in the development of biologically-based closed-loop regenerative life support, in-situ resource utilization, and will have extensive interactions with human and plant hosts. Further, microbes may pose challenges through virulence and contamination, and as nuisance factors such as biofilms in water supply and ventilation systems.
Last edited by Mars_B4_Moon (2023-09-29 18:44:25)
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For Mars_B4_Moon ....
Thanks for adding new links (and comments) to the topic ...
While the topic was created with half Gravity as the theme, Mars itself is NOT offering half Gravity, so a related question is:
Is .38 Gravity enough to stay healthy on Mars, or on Large Ship headed to Mars?
As far as I can tell, no one actually knows the answer, so your reporting of experiments to find out is helpful!
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There is some reason to suspect that fractional-gee gravity will mitigate the effects of zero gee. It's very likely that its effectiveness depends upon the actual fraction of a gee. But nobody knows for sure, because those experiments have not ever been done! They require spinning space stations, which have never been built.
As for centrifuges, the gee level produced uses the same spin gravity equation as spinning space stations: to 3 significant figures, gee = (radius/56 m)*(spin rate/4 rpm)^2. If you use a high spin rate, you can use a short radius. The equation tells you how they relate.
But, there are definite limits on the spin rates that can be endured, and they vary from species to species, because not every species is the same size, and not every species has the same balance organ design. The limits are higher for short intervals. But for long term exposures, current best estimates are 3 to 4 rpm max for humans. There really is some related experimental data to back that up.
Sorry, but that's what you have to deal with.
GW
GW Johnson
McGregor, Texas
"There is nothing as expensive as a dead crew, especially one dead from a bad management decision"
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