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We are sending robots that are leaving too much to question.  A full-time human station (like the barrows point at the north pole) will answer the questions in totallity instead of half-answers.

I still haven't seen how you think robots will react to unknown varibles.  They may be the best now, but humans are better with unknown varibles than robots.
probably.  but only in direct supervision with humans (like the canada arm. . .)

what does IMHO mean? I see it all over the mars forum.

the rails would have to buried or affected by a slide of dust to be serriously affected.  I am assuming martian dust is not that hard to blow off the rails. . . .as for the train cars, there could be shelters every 100+ miles on the track for them to wait it out.  if argol is right and dust storms are not very destructive, then the trains could just ride right through them as a dust storm could last 20 years.

if the asteroid was nothing but a gravel pile (as most asteroids are) then that would explain why nothing is there.  It was all anhilated or turned into dust by the impact (most of it anyways) and any remaints would be extremly difficult to find.

It sounds like Wialowa is claiming that NASA is doctoring pics to hide something.  Wialowa is not saying what exactly NASA is hiding, though.  I am doubtful to the extent that FLMASK can work on bitmaps unless there is a definate pattern on the bitmap, but I do believe doctoring could be found on a jpeg pic. . . .I am interested to hear if josh thinks Ian is right.  I would like to hear what it is that they are hiding most of all if it is right.

Visited by Moderator 2022/01/28

hate to be an optimist but the world is way better than it was in the middle ages for most people anyways. .. .africa does have its problems but that is mostly from starvation due to the fact that immunization saved so many that would have died of diaseses.  I certianly think we have come some way as a nation (usa). . . .

anyways the defination of poverty is rather subjective, and changes time to time.  in the middle ages the middle class had a standard of living equilivant to trailer park living.  The nobilty were only slightly better, with a standard equilivant to the lower middle class today in america.  From the standpoint of the early 1900s we have come a long way, too, with electric power and plumbing. 

I doubt war will ever be banished, as there is always a time for war.  I am sure the frequency of war will quiet down at times but there will always be war, and only a damn-fool idealist will believe war can be banished.

Poverty is subjective and relative, so we will always have that.  But, from a objective standpoint, it is better to keep improving the material quality of life for everyone. . .

Ok, I see what you are saying now. 

but

I don't entirely agree with.  As it stands right now, the american public at large doesn't see the threat of china in space.  They hear only that china is doing technology from the 1960s and I know that NASA hasen't really advanced far from the technology of the 1970s. . .

but the american public doesn't know that.  Most of them still think that the space shuttle can go to the moon (it can't) and that NASA is overflowing with bleeding edge technology of our day. 

The public just doesn't see it, and if china lanches some rockets, they won't care because of the preconcieved notion that NASA  is more modern in its technology.  Of course, there is some racist element that refuses to admit the chinese might beat us at the space game.

is china a superpower right now?  economically, to some degree it is.  but russia in 1950 was fresh off defeating the most advanced armies in the world, and was considered the greatest miltary power in the world.  China does not stand like that at all today.  While their armies are quickly modernizing, they have not proven themselves as a miltary power.  the american public won't reconize china as a miltary power unless china proves itself to be a miltary power, nukes or no nukes.  The only way americans will wake up to chinas power is if china invades some country.  The public at large just doesn't see china as a threat despite the e-11 incident. . .

I voted for complex life on earth only. . . .I defined complex life as life that is steinent.  The odds of other stientit (arg cant spell right) occuring is absolutly absymal if you take into consideration the factor of time.

clark, I think your moon base proposal and space race w/ china is forgeting one thing.

     After 1945 american and russian troops faced across the border of europe and prepared for battle. 

      We don't have such a conflict with china right now (except the possiblity of an Korean Intervention) and most americans don't care about china in the least bit.  They won't care unless some poor neighbor of theirs dies in a battle against china.  (or in some land that china claims is theirs)
 
       I don't see the motive for a space race.  Just because china is doing it dosen't mean the whole world will jump in and do it (unless china 'steals' my asteroid mining plan. . .www.parksweb.com/nateweb). 
 
        The american public doesn't care, the american public thinks space is for damn-fool idiots that are rich members of the establishment.  America is 'planet-locked' so to speak and that mentality doesn't change unless it aint planet-locked no more. . . .
     
          So show me the motive for a moon base and space race (I'm all in favor of another one!) as I am curious to see what motive the US of A would have to race china.

true, but if they are only sick, they can heal themselves.  Sick robots can't heal themselves and if they could, they would need such a large multitude of assistance that a mission would greatly increase in cost.  Lets face it; robotics break down frequently and are not very suitable for an enviroment with so many varibles, most of them unknown.

It won't be manipulated better telerobotically.  consider the 4-9 minute gap between communications and all that can transpire between.  man on site will do more meanifull work. If a varible occurs that the operators discover, it is probably going to be hopeless to save the mission.

I believe if robotics are to suceed in space, robots will have to be able to deal with varibles and untill that happens (not until AI will that happen) robotics in space is largely a pipe dream.

I believe there will always be a few who won't screw around Espically if that is an option, in places like the US of A.  If some don't screw around then it is almost certian that they will not get HIV or AIDs. . .long live absentinice. . .

only if boatloads of profit can be made.  Nuff said. . .damn-fool scientests probably will not be able to convince anyone to do it for them.  besides, the origianal mission had science as a back-burner thought, at least in the first few missions. . . .