New Mars Forums

What is CEV....

Simply whatever Dr Griffin can make happen and at what stage.

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/376/1]Space Review article

50 years, no chance. The only reason 50 years should be mentioned is as a statement of what you expect to be the situation in that time. An ultimate goal.

ie In 50 years I want there to be at least one Martian colony etc.

Then we should use smaller length plans to utilise existing technology and to develop new technologies so that the ultimate goal can be realised.

Well the last Topic has gone well over 300 posts and will likely self destruct soon so I have started this one.

What you have a concern over the Russian press

ITAR-TASS 

Still it would not make sense ever politically or financially for the US to suddenly allow other launch systems to be used by bigelow until the capabilities for the USA companies to do it where already in place.

We can automate a lot of processes but in the case of robots we have found that the capability of a robot is let down by its thought processes. Robots have more or less cracked the ability to have motion, power, ability to utilise items and vision. The stumbling block is there brain we have to program them and it makes them want to follow step one then step two processes and this limits there effectiveness. Of course Telerobotics where simple avoidance control mated with a master command by a human operator can makes for a much more effective system for use in construction and in resource utilisation.

The problem with this becomes communication and control lag. In the case for the Moon this is not too much of a problem but with mars distance it means that effectiveness will be much more a problem. Still NASA has been experimenting with these systems as a robot does not need 3 hours of pre breathing to be ready for a space walk and in an emergency a "Robonaut" will be able to get to the problem site a lot faster. And the Robonaut is a telerobotic device which acts and uses tools like a human can just better (in space anyway)

Interesting point to this if we are "downloaded" then what rights do we have, are we human and if we come up with a real AI what rights does this have compared to a "downloaded" human copy. And do you have to be dieing to have the "download" happen. Could there be more than one of you in a computer system.

Still a human brain controlling machinery is a very useful technological trick as this would allow machinery to work in places that are dangerous for a purely human brain or to allow a human mind to control machines capable of doing much more than pure flesh and blood can.

Still I think it will answer one thing, are what we do the result of our hormones like love, anger, hate or do we find that emotions will fade if we are no longer flesh and blood.

Having seen Saddam in his gleaming white underwear one political hack did dare to mention.

" Well at least we have found one thing Biological in Iraq. The stuff Saddam uses to clean his smalls "

Maybe its me but I found that funny. 

I agree with you Cindy, then again it could be a good thing if,

It shows the Iraqi people he is only mortal and not something to be feared after all. May even show some of the benefits that freedom will give them especially a chance to try in a fair court someone who has blighted his country and been responsible for the murder of thousands.

Ah but then again Saddams rights have been abused due to someone taking a photo of him in his underpants and looking silly. Awwww my heart bleeds

For those who dont know (ie non British). There is a Tony Christie revival going on promoted by a comedian called peter Kay. It was the official song of the Charity Comic relief.

But the real fun comes down to these guys in Iraq making this video and then with so many servicemen and women linking and then mailing it to friends to see it at 52 Mb a time that the UK defense department and RAF strike command computer system crashed.

Apparently though it has been the single most effective Morale boost the UK forces have had since the 2nd world war ended.

No can do the Apollo site is an active stucture belonging to the USA any hindrance or touching would be a breach of the outer space treaty. And I have to ask if you wanted to take plutonium to the Moon. Why. If you can get it up there just fire it off to the sun instead!!!

Yeah superconductors are great for this purpose as the shade on the Moon is pretty much at a uniform tempature and if the cable is buried and under an insulated cover with a regolith bern above then it would be well protected and cold. We will need to create a solid power grid so when we expand from the initial foothold we can bring the power we need to the new site. Eventually we will have power being put in the grid from somewhere on the Moon all the time.

Still to make superconductors is going to need materials from Earth though its actual manufacture would be done on the Moon. Though the materials needed would not be too heavy as previously said the superconductors will be very light as thickness is not a concern unlike on Earth where the more power that is being conducted the more thickness the wire has to have. The solar panels that generate power and insulated covers will all be produced on the Moon.

Its not the rights that are a problem its the size you do know the thing is over 2500 km square. We would need every ship in the USA all pulling to get it moving. and steering forget it.

Well we can allways dig in a cable from our base to the points where long periods of sunlight can be found, If we use superconducting materials which will work in the very cold of the lunar dark and dig these in and insulate them then we will have no power loss. As the article states its a distance of 600 miles minimum. And it is when we have no light at our base that we need the power from the poles.

The process can be done by a rover especially designed for the job. No need to have people actually doing it and simply digging the small trench and installing the cable is perfect for teleoperation work. Apollo found lunar regolith to be a very effective insulator and easily moved up to about 13 to 17cm deep but well compacted after that. We would simply cover the cable and an insulated armoured cover made of local materials with gathered regolith and pat it down.

I have in previous posts called for a lunar power grid backed by superconducting wires. Superconductors in the dark areas we will make, will not lose much if any power to resistance so power generation from one site will be available to all. And since as stated superconductors dont suffer much from resistance they can be made thin and also very light and be useful. Since we can use superconductors that have been created now it also means no new research is needed to start such a grid and with a vacuum being needed to make some of the best conductors then the Moon would be a perfect place to make these as gravity is often needed too.