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#376 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 16:06:18

Texas is in the top part of the list for states that are having business coming to them.

It appears NH is on the short end of the straw.

Under Biden these were to happen

Under the Biden-Harris administration, the 2022 CHIPS and Science Act has catalyzed over $400 billion in private investments for U.S. semiconductor manufacturing. Major projects include TSMC in Arizona ($6.6B+ funding), Intel in four states ($7.86B+ funding), and Micron in New York/Idaho ($6B+ funding), creating thousands of construction and manufacturing jobs.

Key semiconductor projects and funding under the Biden administration include:

TSMC Arizona: Awarded up to $6.6 billion to build three leading-edge factories in Phoenix, representing over $65 billion in total investment.

Intel: Finalized $7.86 billion in funding to support major projects in Arizona, New Mexico, Ohio, and Oregon.

Micron Technology: Awarded $6.1 billion for projects in New York and Idaho, with groundbreaking in New York marking a massive investment for the region.

Samsung Electronics: Received funding to expand its advanced manufacturing capability in Texas.

Hemlock Semiconductor (Michigan): Proposed $325 million to boost production of critical polysilicon materials.

The initiative aims to reverse the decline in U.S. chip manufacturing, which had fallen to a small fraction of global production, by securing supply chains for artificial intelligence and national security needs. The projects are expected to generate over 115,000 manufacturing and construction jobs across the country

So where are they under the promises of the past?

Only Micron Technology in NY has broken ground

#377 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Synthetic or Natural Fuel Produced using Solar Power » 2026-01-25 15:35:26

Its been a while but here is New York startup builds fridge-sized machine that can turn air into gasoline

AA1UVP9D.img?w=768&h=431&m=6

https://www.aircela.com/


You can't get something for nothing, and if it seems too good to be true, it usually is. However, the Aircela machine seems to be an exception to these rules, with its ability to create gasoline using little more than electricity and the air that we breathe. It sounds like the science fiction of a "Star Trek" replicator, but the process is rooted in science facts. While it's not quite the free energy it sounds like at first, the technology in its current state has some practical, small-scale applications, which are exactly what Aircela is targeting.

The Aircela machine works through a three-step process. It captures carbon dioxide directly from the air. While this process doesn't nearly offset how much carbon cars spew into the air, it is a sound process that works, though usually on a much larger scale than Aircela's. The machine also traps water vapor, and uses electrolysis to break water down into hydrogen and oxygen instead of destroying your car's cooling system. The oxygen is released, leaving hydrogen and carbon dioxide, the building blocks of hydrocarbons.

This mixture then undergoes a process known as direct hydrogenation of carbon dioxide to methanol, as documented in scientific papers. Methanol is a useful, though dangerous, racing fuel, but the engine under your hood won't run on it, so it must be converted to gasoline. ExxonMobil has been studying the process of doing exactly that since at least the 1970s. It's another well-established process, and the final step the Aircela machine performs before dispensing it through a built-in ordinary gas pump. So while creating gasoline out of thin air sounds like something only a wizard alchemist in Dungeons & Dragons can do, each step of this process is grounded in science, and combining the steps in this manner means it can, and does, really work.

AA1UVT9o.img?w=768&h=431&m=6

Aircela does not, however, promise free gasoline for all. There are some limitations to this process. A machine the size of Aircela's produces just one gallon of gas per day. That's not going to keep your nine-MPG Bugatti Chiron Super Sport going for very long, or even your 43-MPG Honda CRX HF. The machine can store up to 17 gallons, according to Popular Science, so if you don't drive very much, you can fill up your tank, eventually. It could probably keep my little Kawasaki Z125 going for quite a while, though.

While the Aircela website does not list a price for the machine, The Autopian reports it's targeting a price between $15,000 and $20,000, with hopes of dropping the price once mass production begins. While certainly less expensive than a traditional gas station, it's still a bit of an investment to begin producing your own fuel. If you live or work out in the middle of nowhere, however, it could be close to or less than the cost of bringing gas to you, or driving all your vehicles into a distant town to fill up. You're also not limited to buying just one machine, as the system is designed to scale up to produce as much fuel as you need.

The main reason why this process isn't "something for nothing" is that it takes twice as much electrical energy to produce energy in the form of gasoline. As Aircela told The Autopian:

Aircelais targeting >50% end to end power efficiency. Since there is about 37kWh of energy in a gallon of gasoline we will require about 75kWh to make it. When we power our machines with standalone, off-grid, photovoltaic panels this will correspond to less than $1.50/gallon in energy cost.

Sustainable energy is the key to making the Aircela machine practical and cost-effective. Running it on the grid from coal or natural gas power plants defeats the purpose of removing carbon from the air, and the electricity will cost more, too. However, investing in both the machines and the solar panels to power them means that the product will cost no more than that initial investment. This could work well in remote desert areas, with plenty of sun and cheap land to set up an extensive solar array.

Even though the entire process is firmly rooted in reality, making gasoline from electricity and air still sounds like science fiction. As Arthur C. Clarke wrote, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." So if you want to dress up as a wizard while making your own fuel, go right ahead.

A Company Wants To Sell You A Small Machine To Make Gasoline Out Of Air

Direct hydrogenation of carbon dioxide to methanol: Systematic generation of multi-stage designs

https://www.jalopnik.com/this-bizarre-v … 1752/]This Bizarre Video Explains Why People Tend To Avoid Using Methanol Fuel

#378 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 15:05:37

I did a check with copilot to see where are these going in for state location which also includes states getting nothing

These states appear at least once in the investment list:

States Mentioned
Alabama

Arizona

California

Delaware

Florida

Idaho

Illinois

Indiana

Iowa

Kansas

Kentucky

Louisiana

Michigan

Mississippi

Missouri

New Jersey

New York

North Carolina

Ohio

Pennsylvania

South Carolina

South Dakota

Tennessee

Texas

Utah

Vermont

Virginia

West Virginia

Wisconsin

States Mentioned Indirectly (multi-state or unspecified expansions)
These were referenced as “across the U.S.” or “across multiple states,” but without specific locations:

Georgia (only implied via “southeastern U.S.”)

Maryland (Baltimore facility acquisition)

Colorado (not mentioned)

Washington (not mentioned)

Oregon (not mentioned)

Nevada (not mentioned)

States NOT mentioned at all
If you're curious, the document includes no investments in:

Alaska

Arkansas

Colorado

Connecticut

Hawaii

Maine

Massachusetts

Minnesota

Montana

Nebraska

Nevada

New Hampshire

New Mexico

North Dakota

Oklahoma

Oregon

Rhode Island

Washington

Wyoming

? Want a map or a table?
If you want, I can also create:

A table showing each company and the state they’re investing in

A count of how many investments each state is getting

A U.S. map highlighting the states receiving investment

A summary by region (South, Midwest, Northeast, West)

#379 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Hubble Space Telescope Permanent Maintenance Station » 2026-01-25 14:55:26

tahanson43206 wrote:

For SpaceNut .... your first post in 2004 showed exactly the same negative orientation as almost all your posts today.

SpaceNut wrote:

The biggest problem with Hubble is not the repair but is when. The actual reason that anything is being done in the first place is that it will come down on our little heads if nothing is done.
With Nasa's budget constantly being stripped or lowered it makes it very hard to do anything but to maintain those programs that are already in the pipe line.
Hubble is definitely worth saving but there must be a limit to the cost. Also Nasa must always design into any probe that circles where ever. The ability for a clean deorbit if it wishes to have safety, or no contamination to the environments that these probes circle to not be impacted.

Look at that ... a list of problems and no solutions....

Over 20 years of listing problems and never once in all those years proposing a solution.(*)

This has ** got ** to change. It is one thing to hold negative views, but to post them frequently in other people's topics is a problem we need to address.  Why would any one want to participate in a forum where the outlook is negative.

(*) I didn't try to read all 20,000+ messages. There might be ONE in that collection that is not negative.

OK ... to be fair, the post from 2004 ** did ** offer a recommendation for policy to plan for de-orbit.  It was a general recommendation. Hubble probably had a de-orbit plan from the day it was launched.  That would be good to know.  It would take work to find out.  Work would take time, and energy, and it might even involve spending some money for a stamp and stationery.  Hubble is still flying. There is still time to find out what the de-orbit plan may be.

What I'm hoping you will do from now on is to ask yourself what you want to do when you create a post.  What is the purpose of the post? Are you trying to warn readers of risks or dangers, or are you trying to alert them to opportunities?  At the end of the post, how will your reader be feeling. Will the reader be uplifted and ready to resume the day with a bounce?

(th)

Not sure which one this is from, but the only game in the fire was NASA supported missions to go and repair for the aspects of science in the visible range with newer telescopes eating up funds that were not going to repairs.

Since missions are up to NASA and the federal nut bags cutting funding no longer getting a payback for the money being spent.

What financing do you have within a billion dollars at the time to supply all equipment replacements and mission to send men to repair it?

Even with the supply telescope cradle required and NASA permission industry see's no value in science....

So whom has deep pockets?

That is not negative its factural....

NASA is not currently pursuing any plans to repair or service the Hubble Space Telescope and has rejected a proposed private mission to boost its orbit. While a study with SpaceX and the Polaris Program regarding a "reboost" was conducted, NASA decided against it due to potential risks, opting instead to manage the aging observatory's operations using a one-gyroscope mode to extend its life into the 2030s.

Key Details on Hubble's Future:
No Active Servicing Plans: NASA announced in June 2024 that it will not move forward with a private mission to reboost the telescope, as this study (YouTube) showed potential for "premature loss of science".

Operational Mode Change: Due to issues with its gyroscopes, Hubble is being transitioned to operate on only one gyro to maximize its remaining operational life.

Continued Operation: Despite the lack of a repair mission, NASA officials (NASA Science) expect Hubble to remain operational and continue producing valuable scientific data through the end of this decade and into the next.

Orbital Decay: Hubble is in a slowly decaying orbit. Without a reboost, it is not expected to re-enter Earth's atmosphere until at least the mid-2030s.

Previous Studies: In 2022, NASA and SpaceX signed an agreement (Space) to study if a SpaceX Dragon capsule (NASA) could raise the telescope's altitude.

While this means no astronaut servicing missions like those during the Space Shuttle era are planned, NASA continues to manage the telescope to function as long as possible

The same response is being given to the ISS as we speak...its just yesterdays trash to them..

#380 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 12:39:51

Manufacturing is not gone is just smaller than the companies that are of old. Some times they grow to rival those companies but for the most part they just last until they are bought out. Then they leave as usually its a competitor that buys them.

The rate of what it took to raise a child is not even part of the equation as when to what we had versus today as the cost to live requires more due to other factors.

Manufacturing jobs in the U.S. generally pay an average of $20 to $25 per hour, or roughly $42,000 to $52,000 annually, depending on skill level and specific industry. While entry-level roles can start lower, skilled roles such as manufacturing technicians or specialized machinists can exceed $60,000 a year.
Key details on manufacturing wages:
Average Hourly Rates: Estimates suggest a range from roughly $17 per hour for general factory workers to over $29 per hour for more specialized roles.
Annual Earnings: While many roles fall between $42,000 and $60,000, 90th percentile earners in manufacturing can reach over $67,500 annually.
Factors Affecting Pay: Wages vary significantly based on location, company size, and specific job duties (e.g., assembly vs. high-skill operator).
Job Roles:
Manufacturing Technician: Average ~ $23.57/hr.
Production Worker: Median wage ~$18.00/hr.
Assembler/Operator: Ranges from roughly $13 to $19 per hour.
Pay often includes additional incentives, such as bonuses for skill certifications or overtime opportunities

Billionaire Trump tells families to just 'give up' products as prices soar Trump has framed the cost of living crunch as a matter of personal choice, for extra's as in not needed to survive.

When most have done so long ago.....

Just on a side note I started to have my children in 1994 with a wage in what was the Cabletron Systems at just less than $8.00 hr.

So the equation of people versus automation change in energy costs

In the U.S. manufacturing sector, automation generally reduces overall operational costs despite increasing direct electrical consumption for equipment. While industrial energy consumption constitutes over 10% of total operating expenses for manufacturers, implementing automated systems typically results in a 30% to 50% reduction in energy usage for HVAC, lighting, and specialized machinery.
Impact on Electricity Costs
Reduced Consumption: Automated systems, such as those using Variable Speed Drives (VFDs) and smart sensors, optimize energy usage by shutting down unused equipment, reducing motor speeds during low demand, and optimizing production cycles.
Energy Savings: Real-world implementations show that advanced automation can lead to 22% reductions in monthly electricity bills and up to 86% energy reduction during peak hours.
Predictive Maintenance: AI-powered automation reduces energy spikes caused by malfunctioning or inefficient machinery, which can otherwise cause unnecessary power consumption.
Increased Efficiency: For example, one advanced industrial robot service was able to reduce machine energy usage by 30% while maintaining optimal performance.
Factors Affecting Costs
Initial Investment: While long-term energy costs decrease, the initial investment for robotic systems can range from $50,000 to over $150,000 per robot, plus integration and facility prep costs.
Industry Trends: U.S. manufacturing firms spend roughly $230 billion on energy annually, but automation is increasingly used to mitigate this cost.
Grid Demand: As manufacturing becomes more automated, the reliance on stable, affordable energy increases, especially with new demands from AI, which have caused some areas to experience up to 267% higher electricity costs over the past five years.
Overall Financial Impact
Automated systems often result in a net savings, with some companies experiencing 12% to 16% reductions in overall operational costs due to a combination of lower labor, waste reduction, and better energy management

n US manufacturing, automation is rapidly becoming more cost-effective than human labor, with ROI for many projects achieved in under 24 months. While automation increases electrical consumption, it often reduces total operating costs and significantly cuts labor requirements—sometimes by up to 80% for specific processes—driven by a shift toward total cost of ownership (TCO) analysis rather than just upfront, low-cost labor.
Cost of Automation vs. Labor Replacement
Labor Substitution: A 2015 analysis suggested that robots could cut U.S. labor costs by 22%. Current data shows that for tasks like assembly or, in the future, with humanoid robots (projected at $50,000 per unit by 2050, matching one year of labor), robots are becoming more economical than hiring, especially as labor costs rise.
Case Studies: A 2017 case study showed a $432,000 automation system replacing 16 workers (across two shifts), which paid for itself in the first year.
Productivity Gains: Automation often reduces total labor usage by 1.4x to 2.3x.
Electrical Power and Energy Efficiency
Energy Impact: While adding robots increases electrical needs, they often reduce energy usage per unit by improving speed and reducing waste.
Energy Reduction: Advanced robots can reduce machine energy usage by 30% while increasing throughput by up to 300%.
Manufacturing Energy Usage: Industrial energy accounts for about 10% of a manufacturing company's operating expenses, and automation helps lower these costs through precision, reducing the need for rework.
Trends in US Manufacturing
Reshoring: Automation enables US companies to overcome higher labor costs, allowing them to compete with offshore manufacturing.
Labor Shortage: The US manufacturing sector is facing a projected shortfall of 1.9 million skilled workers by 2033, making automation a necessity for survival.
Job Impact: While jobs are displaced, automation often shifts demand toward higher-skilled workers who can operate, maintain, and repair the new, automated technologies

This is why it fails as it did not continue the cost to program or fix only to produce items count....But the hard work is that people will work

The "new slave labor" in US manufacturing that is replacing human workers is not a traditional form of forced human labor, but rather the rapid adoption of AI-powered automation and advanced robotics (often referred to as "sewbots" or "industrial robots"). These technologies are increasingly used to perform repetitive, manual, and physically demanding tasks 24/7 without fatigue, effectively displacing low-skilled human workers and, in some cases, enabling companies to bring manufacturing back to the US by reducing labor costs by up to 50%.
Here is a breakdown of how this shift is occurring:
Automation as the New "Labor Force": In industries like textiles, footwear, and automotive, robots are being deployed to take over jobs previously done by hand. For instance, "sewbots" are replacing humans in garment assembly, with one machine potentially doing the work of 10 people.
Economic Drivers: High-intensity automation allows US manufacturers to combat high domestic labor costs, making onshore production competitive against overseas factories.
The "Worker as Robot" Phenomenon: Beyond direct replacement, a form of "modern slavery" in the workplace involves organizing manufacturing into cells where humans are forced to operate in a "clockwork of continuous motion" alongside machines, with no idle time, effectively treating human workers as if they were machines.
Impact on Human Labor: While automation reduces the need for manual labor, it creates a high-intensity work environment for the remaining workers who must manage these machines.
Other Aspects of Forced Labor in Manufacturing
While robots are the primary driver of replacing human labor in US factories, the broader supply chain still faces issues with literal forced labor, including:
Prison Labor: In the US, some manufacturers utilize prison labor, which is often considered a coercive and exploitative system.
Global Supply Chain Exploitation: Goods produced with child or forced labor abroad (such as in mining for components) continue to enter US markets, according to the Department of Homeland Security

#381 Re: Meta New Mars » RobertDyck Postings » 2026-01-25 12:12:45

The businesses once upon a time did retraining for those next level up jobs but that stopped when automation cost for power made them move out of the US as those jobs vanished making manufacturing pay even less than what they had been getting.

Rotating layoffs where the excuse to hirer new employees at even lower rates claiming business slow down. After those people did not seek out those jobs taking what ever they could get which were lower paying more part time jobs.

#382 Re: Meta New Mars » Housekeeping » 2026-01-25 12:07:28

First item is power or energy to whom?

We already know that business and residential are on different price rates, why?

How many home power system do you have past the portable power generators that are for temporary use, and what can be purchased with solar panels with batteries for that energy self sufficiency it is not as they have been priced out of reach?

#383 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 11:57:08

You seem to have forgotten my past which was manufacturing assembly by hand that moved to getting cheap parts from Mexico for poor quality to pulling it back and to going with automated line assembly that reduced people to button pushers to keep the line producing product.

So labor hours was the issue for making profits and then came the bill for the electrical change over for automation followed by closing and moving south where labor was cheaper.

Moving to automation when power is not regulate to keep cost down will not work.

Energy is already capable of independence but wants cheap fuel sources but even when they are available the prices to its customers still goes up.

As kbd512 indicate its not that we can not manufacture we do not pay well enough to keep people loyal to stay for the low pay. This has to due with location of the plant and nothing will fix that.

Automation and Robots are just the new slave labor but it comes at an energy cost that business are not willing to pay at the same rate as those that need them for residential use.

#384 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 08:46:26

"reestablish self-sufficiency" for whom the user or the creator? As the current is making it not affordable.

Farmers make plenty of food but by time it gets to the consumer its no longer affordable...

The reason of getting cheap labor AKA slaves is a thing of the past that should be buried but corporate want fat profits that always lands on the head of the people whom work for them.

Wages, benefits or insurances, pensions or retirement but these are the things for loyalty and demanded by states and federal government.

Taxes from town, state, and federal government putting there hands into the pocket of the company.

Regulations for companies that forgot how to be responsible for the waste created.

#385 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 08:37:37

There is another part of the picture and that is the businesses that failed.

Notable American businesses that failed in the 1960s include the Studebaker Corporation, the Lehigh and New England Railroad, and early ventures by American Motors (AMC). These failures highlight how quickly a company's fortunes could change due to new competition, changing consumer tastes, and poor management.
Studebaker Corporation
For over a century, Studebaker was a household name that produced wagons, cars, and trucks. But intense competition and insufficient resources eventually led to its downfall.
The rise of compact cars: In the late 1950s, Studebaker's compact Lark model had a sales bump. But its advantage disappeared in the 1960s when the "Big Three" (General Motors, Ford, and Chrysler) introduced their own compacts.
Lack of capital: Studebaker lacked the funds to invest in the frequent redesigns needed to compete with larger automakers. This led to cost-cutting measures, including closing its main factory in South Bend, Indiana, in 1963.
High-risk gamble: In a final effort to boost sales, Studebaker released the innovative Avanti sports coupe in 1963. However, production problems and a costly labor strike doomed the project. The company ceased all automotive production in 1966.
American Motors Corporation (AMC)
While AMC survived the 1960s, its missteps during this decade paved the way for its later collapse. After early success with compact, economical cars, management decided to chase trends instead of building on its niche.
Failed strategy: In the mid-1960s, AMC's strategy was to compete directly with the Big Three by creating trendy, larger, and more powerful vehicles.
Disastrous model: A prime example of this failure was the 1965 Marlin, a large and ungainly "pony car" meant to compete with the wildly successful Ford Mustang.
Lost momentum: By abandoning its unique focus on smaller, efficient cars, AMC lost its edge. When the larger automakers began making more economical vehicles in the 1970s, AMC could not keep up due to its limited resources.
Lehigh and New England Railroad (LNE)
Many American railroad companies struggled in the 1960s, a trend that accelerated in the following decade. The LNE was a major early casualty.
Dependence on coal: The LNE's fortunes were tied to the anthracite coal industry in Pennsylvania. As the demand for coal rapidly declined, the railroad's future became untenable.
Preemptive shutdown: Even while still turning a profit, the LNE's board saw the writing on the wall and decided to cease all railroad operations in October 1961, liquidating while they still had assets.
Pan American World Airways (Pan Am)
Though the company did not go bankrupt until 1991, the roots of its decline can be found in the 1960s. After being the world leader in international travel, the airline began to face significant challenges.
Overextension: Under CEO Juan Trippe, Pan Am became overextended with a sprawling route system that was costly to maintain.
Large investment: The company made a massive investment in a fleet of Boeing 747 jumbo jets in the mid-1960s. This proved to be a risky move, as an economic downturn and rising fuel prices in the following decade made the jets much more costly to operate.
Growing competition: The 1960s saw intense competition from both foreign and domestic airlines. Without a strong domestic route network, Pan Am was left vulnerable

Several notable US businesses failed in the 1970s due to various factors like changing consumer preferences, technological advancements, and economic downturns, including department store chains like Bonwit Teller and W.T. Grant, and the Franklin National Bank. The decline of large manufacturing employers also had a devastating impact on regional economies, as seen with the "Boeing Bust" in Seattle.
Retail
W.T. Grant: A large department store chain that went bankrupt in 1976.
Bonwit Teller: An upscale department store that eventually lost its prestige and was demolished.
S. S. Kresge: In 1977, this company sold its original stores and renamed the Kmart stores to Kmart.
E. J. Korvette: Another large retail chain that is no longer in business.
Bonwit Teller: An upscale department store that lost its prestige and was eventually demolished.
Banking
Franklin National Bank: A large bank that failed in 1974 due to issues in its foreign exchange portfolio and was eventually acquired by European-American Bank & Trust Company.
Technology
Sony Betamax: While a 1975 invention, the Betamax format ultimately lost the "format war" to VHS, largely because rival companies adopted the competing VHS format and Sony kept its format proprietary.
Manufacturing
Boeing: The cancellation of the SST program in 1971 led to massive layoffs and a significant economic downtown in the Seattle area, a period known as the "Boeing Bust".
Other sectors
Pan American World Airways (Pan Am): The airline, once a symbol of American innovation in air travel, failed to withstand economic pressures and turbulent times, collapsing in 1991

Several major US businesses failed in the 1980s due to various factors like market shifts, failed product launches, and the Savings and Loan crisis. Examples include KCO, a video game and toy company that went bankrupt after an overextension into computers, and the failure of RJ Reynolds' "Premier" smokeless cigarettes. The steel industry also began its major decline in the late 1980s, with Bethlehem Steel starting its decline during that period, and the Savings and Loan crisis led to the failure of many financial institutions. 
KCO: The company, known for Cabbage Patch Kids, went bankrupt in the mid-1980s after launching the unsuccessful Atom computer and failing to compete with Nintendo's NES.
RJ Reynolds: Introduced a failed smokeless cigarette called "Premier" in 1989, which was pulled after only five months due to poor consumer reception and a high cost of over $300 million.
Bethlehem Steel: Began its significant decline in the late 1980s as the US transitioned away from industrial manufacturing, although it didn't fully close until 1998.
Savings and Loan institutions: The Savings and Loan crisis of the 1980s and early 1990s resulted in the failure of many banks, with 1,617 FDIC-insured commercial and savings banks closing or receiving financial assistance during that period

Several major US businesses failed in the 1990s due to factors like increased competition, failure to adapt to market changes, and poor management, including the iconic department store chain Woolworth's and PC manufacturer Compaq. Other notable failures include the defunct toy retailer KB Toys and Frito-Lay's fat-free "WOW! Chips" line, which failed due to digestive side effects.
Retail and department stores
Woolworth's: Faced increasing competition from stores like Walmart and Target, leading to the closure of its U.S. five-and-dime stores in 1997 before the parent company rebranded as Foot Locker.
KB Toys: Went bankrupt and vanished due to competition from big-box retailers and the rise of e-commerce.
Gantos: A women's clothing chain that filed for bankruptcy and liquidated its stores by the end of the decade.
Technology
Compaq: Once the largest PC supplier, it faltered due to product quality issues and an inability to keep up with low-cost competitors like Dell. The company was eventually acquired by Hewlett-Packard in 2002.
Etoys.com: An early online toy store that collapsed when the dot-com bubble burst.
Tiger Electronics: Its "Arzone" portable gaming device failed due to its blurry screen and clunky gameplay.
Food and drink
Frito-Lay WOW! Chips: The "fat-free" chips, made with Olestra, caused severe digestive issues for many consumers, leading to the product's failure.
Zima: This clear, carbonated malt beverage was marketed as a sophisticated alternative to beer but failed to gain traction with consumers.
Other
Blockbuster Video: While its collapse occurred in the early 2000s, its failure to adapt to streaming and buy Netflix was rooted in the 1990s, making it a notable example of a 90s-era business failing to look ahead

Several major US businesses failed in the 2000s due to issues like accounting scandals, failure to adapt to new technology, and a lack of innovation. Prominent examples include Enron and WorldCom (accounting fraud), Blockbuster and Polaroid (failure to adapt to digital streaming and photography, respectively), and the dot-com bubble failures like Pets.com and Webvan.
Failed due to accounting scandals
Enron: Once a leading energy company, its collapse in 2001 was one of the largest accounting scandals in history, says the FBI.
WorldCom: The telecommunications giant also collapsed due to a massive accounting scandal in 2002.

During the 2010s, many long-standing US businesses failed due to a combination of new technology, shifting consumer behavior, and heavy debt. The "retail apocalypse" was a primary driver, as e-commerce giants like Amazon displaced traditional brick-and-mortar stores.
Prominent failures in the 2010s
Retail
Toys "R" Us: Filed for bankruptcy in 2017 and closed all US stores in 2018. It struggled to compete with Amazon and Walmart and was burdened with massive debt from a leveraged buyout in 2005. The brand later attempted a comeback with a smaller footprint.
Sears Holdings Corp: The parent company of Sears and Kmart filed for bankruptcy in 2018. The iconic department store chain suffered a slow decline from intense competition from big-box and online retailers.
Borders: The bookstore giant filed for bankruptcy in 2011 and liquidated its remaining stores. It failed to adapt to the shift to online bookselling and e-readers, leaving its customers and website to its competitor, Barnes & Noble.
Payless ShoeSource: The discount shoe retailer filed for bankruptcy in 2017 and 2019, closing all 4,400 stores across 30 countries. It was unable to compete with online retailers and other discount stores.
RadioShack: Known for electronics and batteries, RadioShack filed for bankruptcy twice during the decade (2015 and 2017). It was a victim of changing tech trends and fierce online competition.
The Bon-Ton: The regional department store chain, which operated stores like Carson's and Younkers, filed for bankruptcy in 2018 and liquidated after not turning a profit since 2010.
American Apparel: The clothing retailer filed for bankruptcy in 2015 and 2016, weighed down by debt and sales declines. The brand now operates as an online-only business.
Entertainment
Blockbuster: The video rental chain, which once had over 9,000 stores, filed for bankruptcy in 2010. The company failed to adapt to the new competitive landscape of Netflix, Redbox kiosks, and streaming services.
Movie Gallery: This competitor to Blockbuster and parent of Hollywood Video filed for bankruptcy in 2010, resulting in the closure of all its 2,400 US locations.
Technology and others
Theranos: The blood-testing startup, founded by Elizabeth Holmes, was one of the most high-profile tech failures of the decade. The company, which was valued at $9 billion at its peak, dissolved in 2018 after it was exposed as fraudulent.
Eastman Kodak Co.: The film photography giant filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 2012. The company, which invented the first digital camera, failed to capitalize on the digital revolution and was a "corporate America poster child" for a company that resisted transition.
BlackBerry: Once a leader in mobile devices, BlackBerry's popularity waned in the 2010s due to its slow adoption of touchscreen technology and app ecosystems. The company exited the smartphone business in 2016 to focus on cybersecurity.
Hummer: The SUV brand was discontinued in 2010 after parent company General Motors filed for bankruptcy the year before. The brand fell out of favor following the 2008 oil price spike and a shift toward fuel-efficient vehicles

Many US businesses failed in the 2020s, especially during the initial COVID-19 pandemic, including retailers like J.C. Penney, Neiman Marcus, J. Crew, and Brooks Brothers. Other significant failures included Bed Bath & Beyond, which went bankrupt in 2023, and Pier 1 Imports, Modell's Sporting Goods, and Art Van Furniture, which all filed for bankruptcy in 2020. Financial institutions like First Republic Bancorp and SVB Financial Group also failed.
Major retail bankruptcies in the 2020s
Bed Bath & Beyond: Filed for bankruptcy in 2023.
J.C. Penney: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Neiman Marcus: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
J. Crew: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Pier 1 Imports: Closed all stores after filing for bankruptcy in 2020.
Modell's Sporting Goods: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Art Van Furniture: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Brooks Brothers: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Tuesday Morning: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Sur La Table: Closed many stores during its 2020 bankruptcy process.
Lord & Taylor: Filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Financial sector failures
First Republic Bancorp: Failed during the banking turmoil in 2023.
SVB Financial Group: Failed during the banking turmoil in 2023

#386 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 08:37:04

The 1960s saw the rise of new businesses in various sectors, including fast food franchises like Domino's Pizza and the first discount retailers such as Kmart, Walmart, and Target. The decade was also characterized by the growth of large conglomerates, the development of shopping centers, and the establishment of tech and service companies like Medtronic, Dolby Laboratories, and Instinet.
Retail and consumer goods
Discount Retailers: Kmart was the first, opening in 1962, followed by Walmart and Target in the same year, which introduced a new model of bulk purchasing to offer lower prices.
Franchises: The franchise boom was in full swing, with chains like Domino's Pizza, McDonald's, and Holiday Inn expanding rapidly.
Shopping Centers: More than 8,000 shopping centers were built during the decade, changing how and where people shopped.
Technology and services
Tech and Manufacturing: Companies like Medtronic, Teradyne, and Dolby Laboratories were founded.
Financial Services: NationsBank, Duane Reade, and Jackson Hewitt were among the new financial and service businesses.
Logistics and communication: Sea-Land Service pioneered containerized shipping, and Instinet launched an electronic system for institutional investors.
Conglomerates and hospitality
Conglomerates: A wave of business acquisitions led to the formation of large, diversified conglomerates like ITT Corp. and Litton Industries.
Hospitality: New hotels were built to accommodate the growing population, and new restaurant chains emerged, such as the Playboy Club

he 1970s saw the establishment of many new US businesses, particularly in the tech sector with the rise of semiconductors and venture capital firms like Sequoia Capital and Kleiner Perkins. Other notable companies started in this decade include retail giants like Days Inn, Chili's, and Chi-Chi's; technology and software companies such as Atari and Microsoft; and others like Intel and Acadian Ambulance. The business landscape also reflected broader societal changes, with the emergence of niche stores catering to specific subcultures, such as record stores and boutiques.
Technology and computing
Intel: A major player in the semiconductor industry, which saw significant growth in memory products like the Intel 1103 DRAM.
Microsoft: Founded in 1975 by Bill Gates and Paul Allen.
Atari, Inc.: Founded in 1972, it became a major force in the video game industry.
Venture capital firms: The decade saw the founding of Silicon Valley's top venture capital firms, such as Sequoia Capital and Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers, both established in 1972.
Retail and services
Days Inn: A hotel chain that began in the 1970s.
Chili's and Chi-Chi's: Two popular restaurant chains that were established during this period.
Apple Computers: Though not a business startup in the 1970s, the company was founded in 1976.
Specialty stores: A rise in niche stores, including record stores and boutiques, reflected the segmentation of the market and counterculture movements.
American Home Shield: A company that was established in 1971.
Other notable businesses
Amdahl Corporation: A computer company established in the 1970s.
Acadian Ambulance: A company that was established in 1971.
DeLorean Motor Company: A car company established in 1975

The 1980s saw the establishment of many new US businesses, spanning various sectors like technology, retail, and direct sales. Notable tech companies founded during this decade include Adobe Inc. and Synnex. Retail and service-based companies like The UPS Store and ShowBiz Pizza Place also emerged. The direct selling industry experienced significant growth, with companies like Herbalife and The Pampered Chef being founded in the 1980s.
Technology and software
Adobe Inc.: A company that would become a giant in the software industry.
Synnex: A technology services company.
Access Software: A video game developer.
Symbolics: A computer company specializing in Lisp machines.
Retail and food service
ShowBiz Pizza Place: A family entertainment center and restaurant chain.
The UPS Store: A retail franchise focused on packing and shipping services.
Amy's Kitchen: A company that prepares and sells frozen organic meals.
Sierra Nevada Brewing Co.: A craft brewery.
Direct sales
Herbalife: A company that sells nutrition, weight management, and skincare products.
The Pampered Chef: A company specializing in kitchen tools.
Nu Skin: A company in the beauty and wellness sector.
Stampin' Up!: A company focused on paper crafting supplies.
Other sectors
Aéropostale: An American lifestyle clothing company.
Airgas: A distributor of industrial gases.
American Graphics Institute: A company providing design and technology training

The 1990s saw the rise of new businesses in both the retail and tech sectors, driven by the advent of the internet and the growth of large-scale retail. Prominent examples include the expansion of big-box stores like Walmart and Target and the founding of online pioneers such as Amazon and eBay. The tech industry also saw the emergence of companies like AOL and Yahoo!.
Tech and e-commerce
Amazon and eBay: Founded in the 1990s, these companies were early pioneers of e-commerce, providing online alternatives to traditional brick-and-mortar stores.
AOL and Yahoo!: The 1990s saw the massive growth of the internet, and companies like AOL, with its dial-up service, and Yahoo!, a search engine and web portal, became household names.
Palm: This company was a leader in the early personal digital assistant (PDA) market before the rise of modern smartphones.
Retail
Big-box retailers: Companies like Walmart and Target expanded significantly in the 1990s, offering a wide variety of products at low prices and changing the retail landscape.
Blockbuster: The video rental giant was at its peak in the 1990s before the advent of streaming services.
Einstein Bros. Bagels: This coffee and bagel chain was established in 1995.
Other sectors
Alamo Drafthouse Cinema: A unique cinema-and-restaurant concept, the Alamo Drafthouse was founded in 1997.
Align Technology: This company, founded in 1997, is the maker of the Invisalign clear aligners.
Energy Transfer: This company, founded in 1995, is a major player in the midstream energy sector

The 2000s saw a rise in new businesses across various sectors, particularly in technology, with notable examples including Alarm.com, 2U, and 5-hour Energy. The decade also witnessed the founding of companies focused on areas like e-commerce, with Ocado launching in 2000, and the emergence of businesses in fields that would grow to include telemedicine and clean beauty by the end of the decade and into the next.
Technology and internet companies
Alarm.com: A company specializing in the smart home and security sector, founded in 2000.
2U: An online education platform that was established in 2008.
ActiveCampaign: A marketing automation and email marketing software company, founded in 2003.
51 Minds Entertainment: An entertainment production company that began in 2004.
Consumer goods and food
5-hour Energy: The popular energy shot brand was created in 2004.
AG Jeans: A denim and apparel company established in 2000.
4moms: A company that produces innovative children's products, founded in 2005.
Other notable companies
Ocado: Although based in the UK, this e-commerce grocery company launched in 2000 with a tech-focused approach to home delivery.
Acceleron Pharma: A biopharmaceutical company that started in 2003

he 2010s saw the rise of many new US businesses, particularly in technology, such as the mobile app economy giants like Uber, Spotify, and Snapchat. While the decade had a lower overall entrepreneurship rate compared to previous eras, it was marked by a surge in highly influential tech startups that grew rapidly through digital platforms and venture capital. Notable examples include Square, Airbnb, and Pinterest, as well as The Real Real in the luxury resale market.
Examples of new businesses from the 2010s
Technology and Apps:
Uber: Founded in 2009, the ride-sharing service grew exponentially throughout the 2010s to become a global mobility giant.
Square: Launched in 2010, this company revolutionized small business payments by creating a simple credit card reader for mobile devices.
Spotify: After launching in Europe in 2008, it entered the US in 2011, shifting the music industry from ownership to a streaming subscription model.
Snap Inc.: The parent company of the Snapchat app, which launched in 2011, became a major player in the social media landscape.
Pinterest: This visual discovery engine launched in 2010 and became a leading platform for inspiration and e-commerce.
E-commerce and Services:
The Real Real: Founded in 2011, this online luxury resale retailer grew rapidly, eventually opening its first brick-and-mortar store in 2017.
Airbnb: While founded in 2008, the short-term rental platform saw its most significant growth in the 2010s.
Beyond Meat: This plant-based meat company was founded in 2009 but gained significant traction in the 2010s before its major IPO in 2019.
Other industries:
Instant Pot: This multi-cooker became a household name after its 2010 release, supported by a massive social media community.
GoFundMe: The online fundraising platform was founded in 2010, providing a new way for individuals and organizations to raise money.
Entrepreneurship trends in the 2010s
Lower Entrepreneurship Rate: The decade was marked by one of the lowest rates of new business creation in recent US history.
Slow Job Growth: New firms hired fewer workers in 2019 than they did in 1982, despite the larger overall workforce.
Growth of the Mobile App Economy: The mobile app store ecosystem provided a new, low-capital way for many startups to reach a massive scale very quickly

Since 2020, the U.S. has experienced a historic surge in new business applications, with record-breaking numbers filed in 2021 and 2023. This sustained period of high business creation is a significant shift from previous decades and was primarily driven by pandemic-induced disruptions and a changing labor market.
New business applications per year
Data based on information from the U.S. Census Bureau.
Year     Business Applications    Change vs. Prior Year    Notes
2020    4.4 million    +24.5%    A sharp increase during the first year of the pandemic, with applications soaring 51% higher than the 2010–2019 average.
2021    5.4 million    +23.5%    A new annual record for business applications, largely influenced by pandemic-era economic and labor shifts.
2022    5.0 million    -6.0%    A slight dip from the 2021 peak, but applications remained well above pre-pandemic levels.
2023    5.5 million    +8.1%    The highest number of new business applications ever recorded in a calendar year.
2024    5.21 million    -4.77%    A moderation from the 2023 peak, though still a period of robust entrepreneurship.
2025    Projected millions    +3.15% (partial data)    As of August 2025, over 3.5 million applications had been submitted, indicating that a high level of business formation is continuing.
Key drivers and characteristics of the boom
Pandemic as a catalyst: The COVID-19 pandemic fueled entrepreneurship by necessity, as many people who lost their jobs started their own businesses.
Shift in work: The rise of remote work and the gig economy gave people more flexibility to pursue entrepreneurial ventures.
Growth in specific sectors: Initial growth was most significant in sectors that supported the "home-based economy," such as e-commerce (retail trade), transportation, and personal services.
Increased diversity: New entrepreneurs in the 2020s have been more diverse than in the past, with women, Black, Asian, and Hispanic shares of self-employed Americans near all-time highs.
Mix of high and low-propensity businesses: The surge included both "high-propensity" businesses, which are likely to hire employees, and a large number of sole proprietorships and ventures less likely to have a payroll.
Long-term outlook
This era of heightened business creation marks a new, higher "plateau" for entrepreneurship in the United States. The surge has proven to be more than a temporary blip, representing a lasting shift in the country's economic landscape

So the shift of job types is clear.

#387 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Reestablishing Domestic Manufacturing Competence » 2026-01-25 08:35:33

Business that have left the US

AI Overview
A variety of American businesses either left the U.S. or closed down entirely during the 1960s, a decade of significant shifts in the U.S. economy. This included the merger of prominent brands, the expansion of some companies into foreign markets, and the failure of many smaller businesses.
Acquisition and consolidation
The 1960s saw many companies become targets for acquisition, leading to the disappearance of once-familiar names.
Good Humor: The Ohio-based ice cream company, founded in the 1920s, was purchased in 1961 by the British-Dutch company Unilever.
Kinney Shoes: This shoe retailer, which started in 1894, was acquired by the F.W. Woolworth Corporation in 1963. It was later shut down completely in 1998, though its legacy remains part of Foot Locker.
Ling-Temco-Vought (LTV): In the 1960s, conglomerates like LTV expanded rapidly by acquiring other businesses. As the era ended, many of these highly leveraged companies saw their fortunes unravel.
American Motors Corporation (AMC): Formed by a merger in 1954, AMC struggled to compete with the "Big Three" U.S. automakers and was eventually acquired by Chrysler in 1979.
Expansion overseas
Many U.S. companies started moving production and expanding operations into other countries, spurred by foreign competition and changes in international trade laws.
Offshoring and nearshoring: U.S. manufacturing began moving to countries with lower labor costs. For example, some factories moved to Mexico, a process facilitated by customs laws that incentivized U.S. firms to conduct labor-intensive assembly operations there.
McDonald's: The fast-food chain expanded internationally in the 1960s, opening its first locations in Canada and Puerto Rico in 1967.
Business failures
For many small businesses and retailers, the 1960s were a time of increased competition from larger corporations.
Decline of small farms: Nearly a million small farms disappeared in the 1960s, consolidated into larger operations that benefited from new farming technologies and government subsidies.
End of an era for retailers: While some famous brands like Woolworth's, Montgomery Ward, and Gimbels wouldn't vanish until later decades, the 1960s marked a period of declining relevance as they struggled against newer competitors like discount chains.
Early signs of deindustrialization
While most major job losses happened later, the 1960s showed early signs of deindustrialization, particularly in the "Rust Belt."
Competition from Europe and Japan: By the mid-1960s, European and Japanese industries had recovered from WWII and began producing cars and other goods that competed directly with U.S. manufacturers.
Early manufacturing job shifts: The manufacturing sector began a longer-term decline in its share of total U.S. employment. The industry moved production to lower-cost domestic areas and, increasingly, overseas

Major US businesses did not "leave" the country in the 1970s, but many either declined, went bankrupt, or were acquired by international conglomerates due to significant economic turmoil. Key factors contributing to this trend included stagflation, increased foreign competition, and two severe oil crises.
Iconic brands that faded or were sold
Oldsmobile: At its peak, this General Motors brand produced America's best-selling car in 1976. However, it saw declining sales as flashier import models gained popularity in the following decades, and GM ultimately discontinued the marque in 2004.
Howard Johnson's: A roadside icon famous for its orange-roofed restaurants, Howard Johnson's was a popular fast-food chain that peaked in the 1970s. However, it struggled to adapt to new competition and evolving consumer tastes, with the brand's restaurant business eventually dissolving.
Woolworth's: The F.W. Woolworth Company, a beloved "five-and-dime" store chain, began facing financial difficulties in the latter half of the 20th century. While it survived into the 1990s, the company eventually closed its US stores.
Sunglass Hut: While the brand still exists, its American ownership ended in the 70s. Founded in Miami in 1971, optometrist Sanford Ziff grew the company to 100 stores by 1986. The Ziff family sold their interest, and Italian eyewear giant Luxottica acquired the chain in 2001.
Reasons for business decline in the 1970s
The era's economic upheaval created a challenging environment for many American businesses.
Stagflation: This unusual economic combination of stagnant growth and high inflation meant consumers had less purchasing power, which hurt sales. Companies could not simply raise wages to compensate, leading to worker dissatisfaction and pressure on profits.
Increased competition: After decades of American dominance, new overseas competition emerged from economies like Japan and Germany. This was particularly impactful on US manufacturing, as foreign companies offered more fuel-efficient cars and cheaper, higher-quality products.
Oil crises: Two major oil price shocks in 1973 and 1979 quadrupled oil prices and caused gas shortages. This sent production costs soaring and drastically shifted consumer demand away from large, gas-guzzling vehicles.
Deindustrialization: This trend began in the 1970s as companies sought cheaper labor, moving jobs and capital out of established industrial centers. This shift hit cities in the "Rust Belt" especially hard, weakening the tax base and local economy

Multiple well-known U.S. businesses and entire industries failed or underwent significant decline in the 1980s, primarily driven by a severe economic recession and the Savings and Loan crisis.
Notable businesses that left in the 1980s
Retail and entertainment
D'Lites: A fast-food chain that offered health-conscious options, D'Lites filed for bankruptcy in 1986, largely because larger competitors started offering healthier items and the public's interest in healthy eating waned.
E.J. Korvette: One of the original discount department stores, E.J. Korvette filed for bankruptcy in 1980 and liquidated its stores.
Toys "R" Us (pre-reorganization): While the brand continued, its financial troubles began in the 1980s amid increasing competition.
F.W. Woolworth Company: The five-and-dime store giant started its long decline in the 1980s, although it continued operating for years.
Babbage's: A software and video game retailer that is now part of GameStop.
Pizza Time Theatre: Founded by Atari creator Nolan Bushnell, this franchise with animatronics went bankrupt in 1984 and merged with competitor ShowBiz Pizza Place, which later rebranded as Chuck E. Cheese's.
Video rental stores: The home video rental business took off in the 1980s with the rise of VHS, but many local and smaller chains failed during this time.
Financial sector
The Savings and Loan (S&L) crisis of the 1980s led to the failure of over 1,000 S&L institutions.
Lincoln Savings and Loan Association: A California-based S&L that was central to the political scandal involving the Keating Five, failed in 1989.
Financial Corporation of America: The parent company of American Savings and Loan, this was the largest S&L at the time of its 1988 bankruptcy.
Industrial sector
Bethlehem Steel: Once the second-largest U.S. steel producer, the company was in decline by the late 1980s due to foreign competition and decreasing domestic demand for manufactured goods. Though the company did not file for bankruptcy until 2001, its shipbuilding business was gone by 1997.
Texaco: The American oil company filed for bankruptcy in 1987 in the middle of a legal dispute with Pennzoil. It emerged from bankruptcy in 1988 and was later acquired by Chevron.
Economic conditions driving 1980s business failures
The early 1980s recession: The U.S. suffered back-to-back recessions from 1980 to 1982. In an effort to combat high inflation, the Federal Reserve raised interest rates, which led to a sharp increase in unemployment and a decline in manufacturing.
The Savings and Loan crisis: Deregulation in 1980 allowed S&Ls to pursue higher-risk investments. When interest rates rose, many became insolvent, and risky commercial real estate loans turned sour. The crisis ended up costing taxpayers an estimated $124 billion.
Global competition: U.S. industrial and manufacturing firms faced new pressure from lower-cost labor in other countries, leading to a decline in America's industrial base

Several major U.S. businesses either left or went out of business in the 1990s, often due to bankruptcy or acquisition. Examples include the major retailer Montgomery Ward and the electronics company Compaq Computers, which was bought by Hewlett-Packard in 2002. The decade also saw major shifts in retail, leading to the bankruptcy and closure of numerous smaller chains and the decline of large department stores like Montgomery Ward, according to this Quora post and this Facebook post. 
Montgomery Ward: A major department store that struggled with competition from big-box retailers and filed for bankruptcy, eventually closing all stores in 2001.
Compaq: A computer company that was a dominant force in the 1990s but was acquired by Hewlett-Packard in 2002, effectively ending its independent existence.
Edison Brothers Stores: A parent company to many 90s retailers like Coconuts and Sam Goody's, it went bankrupt in the 1990s and sold off its various brands.
Circuit City: The electronics retailer struggled with competition and filed for bankruptcy in 2008, closing all its stores.
Tower Records: The once-dominant music retailer filed for bankruptcy in 2006.
Radio Shack: The electronics chain filed for bankruptcy in 2015, marking the end of an era for the company.
Blockbuster: The video rental giant was unable to compete with the rise of streaming services and filed for bankruptcy in 2010.
Toys "R" Us: The toy retailer, once a symbol of childhood, filed for bankruptcy in 2017 and closed its stores, though the brand has since made a comeback.
Other businesses that left in the 90s
Pan Am: The airline ceased operations in 1991.
Kodak: The photography giant struggled to adapt to the digital age, filing for bankruptcy in 2012.
Enron: The energy company was involved in a massive accounting scandal that led to its collapse in 2001.
Polaroid: The instant photography company filed for bankruptcy in 2001.

Some of the most prominent U.S. businesses to leave or disappear during the 2000s were major brands in technology, retail, and manufacturing. The reasons they left varied, including failure to adapt to new technology, poor management, intense competition, and—in the case of companies that relocated overseas—corporate tax inversions.
Companies that went out of business
Blockbuster: The video rental giant failed to adapt to the rise of online DVD rentals (like Netflix) and streaming services. The company filed for bankruptcy in 2010.
Compaq: Once the largest personal computer supplier, Compaq was acquired by Hewlett-Packard in 2002. Internal conflicts and poor strategy weakened the brand, which was phased out by HP.
Enron: The energy company collapsed in 2001 due to a massive accounting fraud scandal that hid billions in debt.
Lehman Brothers: The 150-year-old investment bank declared bankruptcy in 2008, holding over $600 billion in assets. Its collapse is considered a significant event that contributed to the global financial crisis.
Limewire: This popular peer-to-peer file-sharing software was shut down in 2010 after a U.S. federal court ruled that it had committed copyright infringement.
WorldCom: This telecommunications rival to AT&T was undone by a major accounting fraud scandal in the early 2000s. It filed for bankruptcy and was later acquired by Verizon.
Borders: The book and music retailer struggled to compete with online competitors and filed for bankruptcy in 2011.
Companies that moved overseas
Anheuser-Busch: The St. Louis-based beer maker was acquired by the Belgian company InBev for $52 billion in 2008. The new parent company, AB InBev, is headquartered in Belgium.
Seagate Technology: The hard-drive manufacturer moved its global headquarters to the Cayman Islands in 2000 and then to Ireland in 2010.
Tyco International: This diversified manufacturing conglomerate relocated its incorporation to Bermuda in 1997. It faced a major scandal in the early 2000s involving its top executives, who were convicted of looting the company.
Accenture: The consulting firm, spun off from the accounting firm Arthur Andersen, reincorporated in Bermuda in 2001.
IBM's Personal Computer division: In 2005, IBM sold its PC division to the Chinese company Lenovo. This move enabled IBM to focus on software and services.
Cooper Industries: This electrical products manufacturer reincorporated in Bermuda in 2002. It was acquired by Eaton in 2012.
Ingersoll-Rand: The industrial manufacturer moved its incorporation to Bermuda in 2002. It has since relocated its official domicile to Ireland.
Factors that drove companies to leave the US
Acquisitions and foreign ownership: Many American brands, such as Sunglass Hut, Ben & Jerry's, and Anheuser-Busch, were acquired by foreign companies during this era.
Corporate tax inversions: To lower their corporate tax burdens, some companies reincorporated their businesses overseas, often in countries with lower tax rates.
Failure to innovate: Companies like Blockbuster and Compaq were unable to adapt to new technologies and market shifts, leading to their demise.
Financial crisis and poor management: The 2008 financial crisis devastated many businesses, including Lehman Brothers. Other companies, like WorldCom and Enron, suffered from corporate misconduct and accounting scandals.
Shifting manufacturing overseas: The trend of outsourcing manufacturing accelerated in the 2000s. Companies seeking lower labor costs and less regulation moved production to countries like China and Mexico

Multiple U.S. businesses either left the country, went out of business, or moved significant operations overseas during the 2010s due to factors such as globalization, shifting consumer trends, and tax laws.
Iconic companies that went defunct
Blockbuster: The video rental giant declared bankruptcy in 2010. It had failed to compete with the rise of streaming services like Netflix and mail-order rentals.
Borders: The bookstore chain went out of business in 2011. Like Blockbuster, it was unable to adapt to the rapidly changing retail landscape dominated by online sellers like Amazon.
RadioShack: A decades-old electronics retailer, RadioShack began closing stores in 2010 and filed for bankruptcy in 2015.
Toys R Us: After years of competition from big-box retailers and e-commerce, the iconic toy store declared bankruptcy in 2017.
Barneys New York: The luxury department store closed its doors in 2019 after facing financial difficulties throughout the decade.
American Apparel: This apparel retailer, known for its "Made in the USA" manufacturing, lost its cultural relevance and was purchased out of bankruptcy by a Canadian company in the mid-2010s.
Companies that moved their headquarters (corporate inversions)
Corporate inversions were a major trend in the early 2010s, where U.S. companies would merge with smaller foreign firms to reincorporate abroad and reduce their tax burden. The U.S. government put the kibosh on such deals in 2014.
Burger King: In 2014, the fast-food chain merged with Canadian company Tim Hortons to form Restaurant Brands International, which was headquartered in Canada.
Seagate Technology: The hard-drive manufacturer officially moved its global headquarters to Ireland in 2010.
Valient: The pharmaceutical company merged with Canada's Biovail in 2010 and relocated its headquarters to Canada.
Companies that offshored operations
A large number of companies offshored manufacturing and other operations during the 2010s to reduce costs, leading to job losses in the U.S..
Cisco Systems: Between 2010 and 2014, the networking company saw its percentage of overseas workers rise from 25% to 46%, primarily in China and India.
Hewlett-Packard (HP): In 2010, the company laid off human resources employees in the U.S., transferring their functions to Panama.
Hilton Worldwide: Also in 2010, the hotelier moved a reservations center to the Philippines to save money.
Ford Motor Company: A significant portion of Ford's workforce was moved out of North America during the 2010s. By 2009, the North American workforce made up only 37% of its total payroll.
JPMorgan Chase: The bank moved its telephone banking operations to the Philippines in 2010

Since the start of the 2020s, numerous US businesses have either gone bankrupt or significantly downsized, with the COVID-19 pandemic serving as a major catalyst for existing financial troubles. Many of these were retailers and restaurant chains that struggled with lockdowns, reduced foot traffic, and shifts in consumer behavior.
Some of the most prominent businesses that went under or dramatically downsized since 2020 include:
Retailers
Bed Bath & Beyond: The home goods retailer, a "recent COVID-19 failure" according to U.S. News, officially filed for bankruptcy in 2023.
Lord & Taylor: After filing for bankruptcy in 2020, the department store chain closed all of its remaining locations in 2021.
J.C. Penney: The long-standing department store filed for bankruptcy in 2020. It was eventually purchased by mall owners Simon Property Group and Brookfield Asset Management, which led to a smaller footprint.
Neiman Marcus: The luxury department store filed for bankruptcy in 2020 and emerged with a reduced debt load.
Pier 1 Imports: The home goods retailer filed for bankruptcy in 2020 and liquidated all of its stores. Its brand name was later relaunched as an online-only store.
Tailored Brands: The parent company of Men's Wearhouse and JoS. A. Bank, filed for bankruptcy in 2020 due to decreased demand for professional wear. It closed hundreds of stores and emerged with less debt.
GNC: The nutrition and supplement retailer filed for bankruptcy in 2020 and closed a significant number of its stores.
Stein Mart: The discount retail chain filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 2020 and liquidated its stores.
Papyrus: The stationery and card company went out of business in early 2020, closing all of its stores.
Century 21: The off-price retailer filed for bankruptcy in 2020 and shuttered its physical stores.
Brooks Brothers: The menswear retailer, which had struggled as business attire became more casual, filed for bankruptcy in 2020 but was later purchased and saved from total shutdown.
Restaurants and entertainment
Friendly's: The family-friendly restaurant chain filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in 2020.
Sizzler: The restaurant chain filed for bankruptcy in 2020, blaming the pandemic for indoor dining closures.
Souplantation / Sweet Tomatoes: The parent company of these buffet restaurants announced the permanent closure of all 97 US locations in 2020.
Chuck E. Cheese: The parent company of the family entertainment chain filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
Cirque du Soleil: The entertainment company filed for bankruptcy in 2020 after the pandemic halted its productions.
Le Pain Quotidien: The cafe and bakery chain filed for bankruptcy in 2020 and sold all of its US locations.
Other sectors
Hertz: The car rental company filed for bankruptcy in 2020 as travel came to a halt during the pandemic.
Remington Arms: The gun manufacturer filed for bankruptcy in 2020.
24 Hour Fitness: The gym chain filed for bankruptcy in 2020 after pandemic-related closures.
Gold's Gym: The fitness chain filed for bankruptcy in 2020 but planned to keep hundreds of locations open.
Intelsat: The satellite operator filed for bankruptcy in 2020 but continued operations

While jobs are being filled the issue is old businesses have comeback after leaving.

Sure new business have stated

Data from the US Census Bureau shows a record-breaking 5,481,437 new businesses were started in 2023. The onset of the pandemic in 2020 has driven a surge in new business creation, so the number of new businesses is trending up. On average, there are 4.7 million businesses started every year.

#388 Re: Not So Free Chat » Politics » 2026-01-25 08:30:21

Saw the video of the Minnesota shooting and the agent pushed a woman, being near the one shot stepped up to rebuke the agent was then mugged and tackled to the ground, pepper sprayed and shot while he struggle for his life all for protecting the honor of the pushed woman.

We are all civilians first regardless of what jobs we do. Assault is still assault even when in a uniform as you are all civilians once the clothes' are off.

Maybe she hit first but did not see that.

Video shows them shooting

#389 Re: Exploration to Settlement Creation » WIKI Constructing things on Mars equipment needs » 2026-01-24 18:39:35

Thanks for the nice equipment post

kbd512 wrote:

tahanson43206,

Whenever a gas expands, it also cools down quite a bit.  CO2 is famous for its "cold" discharge from fire extinguishers.  I can personally attest to how cold it gets, having used them on real fires aboard ship.  Plain old gas or liquid CO2 discharged through the cutting head would cool the cutter.  Heat from friction becoming so intense that it melts the cutter is what typically dulls the cutter because industrial rock cutters are always much harder than the materials they cut or drill through.  If these cutting bits had small passages drilled through them so that liquid or gaseous CO2 could absorb and carry away the heat generated during rock cutting, then the cutter could continue to cut as long as the coolant supply was expanded through holes in the cutters.

I happen to think that pressurized coolant, meaning liquid CO2, would work best, because pressurization keeping the CO2 inside the cutting head or drill bit in a liquid state would prevent gas expansion cooling to the point where residual water vapor trapped in the CO2 would freeze and potentially clog these very narrow coolant passages.  This implies some kind of rotary pump to maintain coolant pressure within the cutting head or drill bit.  All of this could be done using the same shaft for a high speed cutter, or a separate geared pump for lower speed cutters.  A high speed rock drill might not need the weight and complexity of a separate geared pump, for example, whereas a much lower speed tunnel boring machine almost certainly requires a coolant pressurization pump and system to circulate coolant to the dozen or more rock cutting heads.  Using supercritical CO2 would require considerable pumping power to maintain sufficient pressurization, but would also work.

These means hand tools like pneumatic rock drills would use plain old liquid CO2 as their coolant.

Ingersoll-Rand pneumatic rock drill:
shopping?q=tbn:ANd9GcR2cNNNgCpmJqDw2rKtDUMlJA-lBLFveXQgEjvqgBsA3GQbUyCc6nshfcnVVTg1XUqTJcaFnPgs5rdS4ELdinFfdCd5kR7eM7s5Xk8fKbWheyCnMiq1tu0kc-M

Worker using a larger Atlas Copco pneumatic rock drill:
rockdrill_close.jpg

SRD25-rockdrill-top?$portrait800$

Assortment of pneumatic rock drilling heads:
Boorkronen_cat.jpg

These cutting heads already have holes drilled in them that could be used to exhaust expanded CO2 coolant through:
Air-Compressor-Pneumatic-Rock-Drill-Taper-Button-Bit.webp

A much larger pneumatic rock drill mounted to a vehicle:
Furukawa_HCR1800-EDII-1-768x937.jpg
He has a shop vac to vacuum pulverized dust out of his bore hole.  This obviously won't work on Mars due to the minor atmospheric pressure difference between Mars sea level and a hard vacuum.  Therefore, a compressed air gun will be needed to blow the dust out of the bore hole.

Hydraulic fracturing using water and CO2 could also be used to greatly limit or entirely eliminate explosives used in excavation and quarrying operations.  Fracking has already begun to replace explosives in underground mining operations.  There's less of a cave-in risk associated with fracking in an underground mineshaft, and no possibility of blowing yourself up.


Now for volume and powering systems numbers for when we try to ship them to mars for use in constructing and building life on mars.

#390 Re: Human missions » Why Artemis is “better” than Apollo. » 2026-01-24 18:34:42

I suspected management decision making for budget and profit margins were behind it.
AKA shuttle disaster waiting to happen....

#391 Re: Human missions » Why Artemis is “better” than Apollo. » 2026-01-24 15:42:54

sort of old news about the SRB smoking its self to destruction but now its a big deal for the coming launch as NASA Artemis rocket booster suffers alarming anomaly in key test

ATK did have these happen but since being bought who knows why this one happened.

#392 Re: Not So Free Chat » Politics » 2026-01-24 15:40:25

Another shooting death with ICE operations in Minnesota

#393 Re: Life support systems » Tunnel Arch Build Method » 2026-01-24 14:51:20

Tunnels are dependent for shape based on the equipment being used to make them.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRW3DiShbOwFQjn9xG33ypq-B30lhjDWShnPqN_X1llMcPqpISOG2vUQoc&s

CE3021 TUNNELING ENGINEERING

#394 Re: Not So Free Chat » What collections of people think people should be property? » 2026-01-24 14:47:25

Here is the history but its not inclusive enough as its still going on even today as we speak of

Chattel slavery was a legal system, prominent from the 16th to 19th centuries, that classified human beings as personal property (chattel) rather than legal persons, allowing them to be bought, sold, owned, and inherited. Enslaved people were subjected to forced labor, lacked legal rights, and were governed by strict codes.

Key aspects of people as property include:
Legal Status: Enslaved people were considered assets, similar to livestock or, in some contexts, real estate.

The Dred Scott Decision (1857): The U.S. Supreme Court ruled that Congress could not prohibit slavery in territories, effectively stating that enslaved people were property and not citizens.

Legal Framework: Laws, such as Slave Codes, denied enslaved individuals the right to marry, testify in court, or own property themselves.

Economic System: The institution was driven by the demand for labor, with millions of people of African descent held in bondage in the Americas.

Case Law: The U.S. Supreme Court navigated the "dual status" of enslaved people as both human beings and legal property, often upholding the rights of owners.

The dehumanization inherent in viewing people as property was a core component of the transatlantic slave trade and the antebellum American South

#395 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Construction Excavation Tunnel Cave on Mars » 2026-01-24 14:42:28

tahanson43206 wrote:

For SpaceNut re excavation topic: http://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php … 46#p237546

Thanks for addition of Elon Musk and Boring Company to the topic! 

If you can find time, please see if there is any public informaiton about the nature of the boring equipment Musk is using.

The reason I ask is because it might work on Mars as is. 

Or perhaps some adjustments are required.  At this point all we know is that the machinery can did tunnels of substantial diameter in Earth regolith.

Earth has an atmosphere with oxygen. Does the  machinery use any of that oxygen?  I don't think we know.

The tailings have to be moved out of the excavated space. What tools are used for that?

Is the system automated?  What maintenance is required, what is checked and what is changed?

Are lubricants used for the cutting operation?

Are lubricants used inside the machine?

Can the machine be shipped in sections that weigh less than 40 tons?

Thanks again for giving the new topic a boost.

(th)

While no operational 3 m diameter TBM specifically for Mars currently exists, the development of such equipment is a key concept in proposed strategies for establishing a Martian colony.

Current Status of Mars Tunneling Equipment
Conceptual Stage:
Current discussions revolve around the concept of using tunneling technology for Mars habitats, providing protection from cosmic radiation and micrometeorites, and leveraging the thermal stability of the subsurface.
Earth-based Prototypes:
Companies like The Boring Company (TBC) are developing advanced, all-electric Tunnel Boring Machines (TBMs) for Earth-based projects (e.g., the Prufrock series, which creates a tunnel approximately 3.7m/12ft in diameter).

Technology Transfer:

While TBC's current machines are unlikely to be deployed on Mars without significant modification, the technology and engineering experience gained (such as automation and faster boring speeds) are seen as foundational for developing future off-world systems.

Prototype Drills:
Research has been conducted on smaller-scale "3-meter-class Mars drill prototypes" for scientific exploration of the shallow subsurface, but these are for drilling, not large-scale tunneling for habitats.
Transportability:
A 3m-class TBM (or its segments) is considered potentially transportable by a SpaceX Starship, which has an 8m diameter cargo bay.

Key Challenges for Martian TBMs
Atmosphere:
Earth TBMs use significant amounts of water for cooling and other operations, which would be a major challenge in Mars's cold, near-vacuum atmosphere.

Automation:
Due to communication delays and the need for efficient pre-human construction, Martian equipment would require a high degree of automation and robotic operation.

Geology & Materials:
The machines would need to be adapted to Mars's unique rock and soil conditions. Also, instead of concrete segments (which are heavy to transport), innovative methods like sintering the excavated rock or using local materials for tunnel lining would be necessary.

In short, 3 m diameter equipment for Mars is an active area of conceptual development and technological aspiration, leveraging Earth-based innovations, but is not yet a developed or deployed product.

Elon Musk's Boring Company develops advanced tunnel boring machines (TBMs), like the Prufrock series, with the long-term goal of enabling underground Martian cities for radiation protection, resource extraction (ice/metals), and efficient habitat construction, potentially using Starship for transport, with Earth projects providing crucial tech and operational experience for Mars colonization needs. The technology focuses on rapid, automated tunneling, which is vital for establishing self-sufficient subterranean life on Mars, where surface conditions are harsh.

How Boring Company Tech Applies to Mars:
Radiation Shielding:
Mars' surface lacks atmosphere, exposing settlers to lethal radiation; burying habitats under Martian rock provides natural shielding.
Resource Utilization:
TBMs can excavate for essential water ice and minerals, crucial for life support and fuel.
Rapid Infrastructure:
High-speed, automated digging allows for quick creation of tunnels for transport (like Hyperloop) and pressurized living spaces, reducing human exposure to dangerous conditions.
Autonomous Operations:
Earth-based experience with "no prior site prep" TBMs (like Prufrock) prepares for robotic deployment on Mars for automated base building.

Key Technologies & Challenges:
Prufrock TBMs:
Designed for rapid, continuous excavation, with capabilities to start digging immediately, a major leap from traditional methods.

SpaceX Integration:
While Starship can carry heavy payloads, transporting massive TBMs (like 1,200-ton machines) poses a challenge, requiring multiple launches or lighter designs.
Atmospheric Advantage:
Mars' thin atmosphere makes underground Hyperloop tunnels ideal, as an artificial vacuum isn't needed.

The Vision:
The Boring Company's work on Earth, including rapid tunneling for tunnels and loops, serves as a practical testbed for the advanced, automated digging needed for large-scale Martian settlements, fulfilling Musk's vision for a multi-planetary humanity.

#396 Re: Science, Technology, and Astronomy » Construction Excavation Tunnel Cave on Mars » 2026-01-24 13:04:11

Elon Musk's Boring TBM so far unless there are going to be other vendors for mars.
To which this is a mass to mars item along with many others that take a given level of power and or alterations before being used on mars.

#397 Re: Exploration to Settlement Creation » Ring Habitat on Mars Doughnut Torus » 2026-01-22 19:06:45

A 10-megawatt (MW) nuclear reactor designed for Mars, often classified as a "Megapower" or small modular reactor (SMR), would likely be a compact, transportable unit, potentially fitting on a large flatbed truck or within a Starship payload bay, measuring roughly 10–20 meters in height. Such units are designed to operate within a small footprint (kilopower systems).

Key Details on 10MW Mars Reactor Sizes:
Scale: While 1–10 kilowatt (kW) reactors (Kilopower) are the size of a wastepaper basket, a 10 MW unit (10,000 kW) requires a much larger, though still "modular" design.

Dimensions: Similar Megapower designs for space applications use compact, modular layouts with Stirling engines, enabling units to be transported in segments and assembled on-site, possibly similar in footprint to a small industrial building.


Configuration: These reactors are often designed to be buried in the Martian regolith for shielding or placed in a shallow crater.

Power Density: A 10 MW reactor is considered a "micro-reactor" in terrestrial terms (1–20 MW) but provides significant power for, say, propellant production and colony infrastructure.

For context, a 10 MW system produces 1,000 times the power of the 10 kW units currently being developed by NASA for early Mars missions

Maximizing electrical power output from a nuclear reactor delivered by Starship to a base on Mars

https://marspedia.org/Nuclear_power

The Martian Surface Reactor: An Advanced Nuclear Power Station for Manned Extraterrestrial Exploration

A 10-megawatt (MW) nuclear reactor for Mars is significantly more compact than an equivalent solar farm, with a core unit that can fit into a relatively small area, although safety considerations require a wider exclusion zone. While current NASA "Kilopower" technology is in the 10-kilowatt (kW) range (40kW total for a base), a 10 MW system, which is 1,000 times more powerful, would likely be a small modular reactor (SMR) or a similar design.

Physical Size of Unit: A 10 MW SMR or similar reactor could likely fit within a very small footprint, potentially just a few hundred square meters for the reactor building itself, similar to, or smaller than, a small Earth-based SMR.

Total Footprint & Safety Zone: While the core, power conversion, and radiator systems are compact, radiation shielding requires an exclusion zone. Based on safety considerations for space-based reactors, a 10 MW reactor would likely require an exclusion area of several acres to several dozen acres (considerably less than 1 square mile, which is 640 acres) for safety and security, though this can be minimized if the reactor is buried or if the zone is sparsely used.

Comparison to Solar: A 10 MW solar farm on Mars would require roughly 50-100 acres, and potentially up to hundreds of acres for necessary battery storage. A 10 MW nuclear reactor would have a drastically smaller, more localized footprint.

Key Factors for 10 MW Nuclear on Mars:
Safety Requirements: Radiation shielding, such as burying the reactor, is essential to reduce the exclusion zone size.

Mass vs. Size: The primary challenge is not the area required to build it on the ground, but the mass and volume limitations of transporting it from Earth to Mars, often requiring assembly on-site.

Efficiency: Small modular reactors (SMRs) are highly efficient, with an estimated capacity factor of around 90 percent

Navigating Nuclear: Microreactors, SMRs, and Traditional Plants

#398 Re: Exploration to Settlement Creation » WIKI Mars structure heating requirements » 2026-01-22 18:48:11

tahanson43206 wrote:

For SpaceNut re interesting post about heat loop on Mars.

https://newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.ph … 93#p237493

Your AI friend seems to have understood that the temperature of the regolith a few meters down is a reliable number, well below the freezing point of water. In another topic, kbd512 added a post to one of Void's topics about use of SCO2 for a geothermal energy harvesting system.

Please ask your AI friend to design a heat pump system that will harvest planetary thermal energy on Mars.

I am hoping the idea is practical, because it would solve a lot of pesky problems.  We humans are going to have to invest energy to live on Mars, so learning how to leverage our investment to harvest thermal energy from the planet itself seems to me like something well work pursuing.

(th)

I did find references that show the loop needs to be a bit deeper but we are not pulling heat as much as giving the loop which is part of the heat pump which uses compression to make heat or in reverse to make cooling.

The system could couple the heat content from the 10 kw electrical kilowatt reactors fed into the same area of the heat pump loop which is 30kw of thermal energy at 500 c  and that changes the systems to more of a functioning heat exchanger.

This takes care of humidity as well as all that is needed is more than one system inside the dome or any other shape that has internal volume of approximately 1,884,954 m^3 or greater.

#400 Re: Exploration to Settlement Creation » WIKI Mars structure heating requirements » 2026-01-22 18:23:52

For a horizontal ground loop heat pump system on Mars, particularly for a large structure such as a 200 m diameter, 120 m tall habitat, the depth requirement for ground loops is significantly deeper than on Earth due to the need to escape massive daily surface temperature swings, radiation, and low soil thermal conductivity.

Recommended Minimum Depth:
Depth: At least 3 to 5 meters (approx. 10–16 feet) below the surface.

Reasoning: To achieve a stable temperature, loops must be placed below the diurnal and annual thermal skin depths, as the Martian regolith is a poor thermal conductor (approx. 0.039 W/m K).

Alternative: Given the scale of the structure, vertical borehole loops (100–300 ft deep) are often more efficient than horizontal trenches due to better heat exchange in deeper, more stable, and potentially denser material.

Key Factors for Mars Application:
Soil Properties: The soil is highly porous (60%) and acts as an insulator, requiring longer pipes and deeper, more extensive trenching for horizontal systems.

Thermal Stability: While surface temperatures can fluctuate wildly, a depth of 3-5 meters provides a relatively stable, though very cold, base temperature (approx. 220 K or -53°C).

Loop Type: Due to the 200m diameter, a slinky loop or vertical bore field would likely be necessary to manage the thermal load.

Safety: A depth of 3+ meters also provides necessary shielding for the loop system against surface radiation and potential meteoroid impacts

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